Race/ethnicity at Faire.

[Bonny Pearl]

Very interesting points have been brought up.

What a lot of people don't realize and are not taught in social studies at school (junior/high school level) is the true history of enslavement in human history.  It wasn't only about one race believing themselves to be superior of another.  It wasn't 'invented' in America.  Our country was the largest and latest and slavery is still very much practiced in some countries to this day.  It was about power and what one could do to get and increase that power and keep it no matter the race, sex or religion.  

Another example of power is the old church system.  Science was a no-no to the church.  Forward thought was a no-no.  You could be jailed, burned, decapitated, etc, for scientific or forward thought.  Once again...  It was about power.

It would be great to see more people from different races, etc, come out and play dress up.

[Anna Iram]

You know, it never occured to me that it would make you feel lonely Blue. I guess, if the roles were reversed I'd feel the same way. Honestly, I hadn't really thought about it at all until now. This thread has got me reading alot of sites.

Yes, I'd read the same thing about guns for slaves. *having tried to read more about this, I find it hard to be clear exatly who all was involved, some say some of the Arab states were involved in this, though yes,it's clear the Europeans ignited conflicts between factions and then arming one side took their captives as payment.*

You're right. Everybody was capturing and enslaving one another and have been from the get go. I've read that before the Europeans became involved the Africans would sell off unruly relatives and even sell themselves into slavery ( for a set amount of time) to pay off a debt or to move up a bit in life. That sort of thing is prevalent in other cultures as well. *Hmmm...note here. In retrospect this seems a Eurocentric thing to say. I'll leave it, but I don't think I endorse this train of thought after all. I expect the reality was not nearly so casual as I make it seem here.*

It wasn't just about power ,though yes it was when you owned your enemy, but it was the economics that really kept the triangle going.  It's bizare how all of the bit's and pieces are tied together.

Lady Season, I grew up in a rural farming community where it was assumed most of us would have no need of a higher eduation. It was a lower inome community and our schools didn't get the best teachers. History was more or less brushed over, so I relate to your sister not being so sure of what seems like the very distant past. Okay...maybe not to the degeee that I thought the Africans wern't around yet... , but I get how that can happen. It's a shame when we aren't all taught our histories and what really happened.

[LadySeasan]

Now, it's a very special thing when we black people see each other enjoying faire together. It made my heart happy to see Seasan and Wesley, IN GARB, out at RenDezvous. In fact, it was a picture of her and Wesley on the old RF banner that made me stick around. There is an exquisitely garbed older black couple that attends Scarby and TRF. I always make it a point to say hello to them. They, like us, are a cultural rarity. And, it's nice to not feel so alone.

black people for the win! lol (is that too much)
but yes, on a serious note, its awesome when i see other black people at faire, IN garb. usually we go, ans we are probably the only black people dressed. and we get asked lots of questions from other black people at the faire, as well as them wanting to take pictures with us

in fact, at this past mdrf, Wes and I spent about 20 minutes explaining what is going on at the faire (King Henry, different social classes etc) to a group of young black children. And they were so entranced, and it felt awesome to give them a different perspective of things that happen outside of their normal community.

[Blue66669]

Well, even at TRF, we're still a bit of a novelty. I can count about 6 black people, and about 15 or so hispanics that make up our cast. It's easier for the hispanics, seeing as though there is a Spanish court.

It's always made things a little more difficult, but I think that getting into this group was really worth it!

[Noble Dreg]

There is nothing wrong with playing up our differences either...The most amazing sight I ever saw at fest was a muscular good-looking black male with a very attractive blonde white female.  He had huge black feathered wings and a "Conan" type look.  The blonde had large white feathered wings and an "elven" appearance.  The pair could not go more than two feet without having to stop for a dozen cameras!

Seperation breeds contempt, coming together, be it Fest or anything else makes for understanding and freindship.

Not too be "PC", but interactions like these help my kids grow up more accepting of that that is "different".

[Capt Robertsgrave Thighbiter]

 I would be curious if, as some one mildly indicated previously, if black attendance would be signifficant if there was a "Kingdon of Kush or Nubia" Festival, celebrating these awesome Empires that pre-date the Renaissance.  I think it would be a great faire to check out.

Or even large Asian presence at a "Canton Faire" focusing on say Ming or Yuan Dynasty life and times.

Seems that we European types dwell on our history and take active pleasure in recreating it.

[Baron Dacre]

 

Another example of power is the old church system.  Science was a no-no to the church.  Forward thought was a no-no.  You could be jailed, burned, decapitated, etc, for scientific or forward thought.  Once again...  It was about power.

It would be great to see more people from different races, etc, come out and play dress up.

Elizabeth had Dr. Dee. Dee was a scientist and a magician. (RPF's "Dr Dee" is a fascinating man and knows more on him than one could probably get from most books)

For the most part the history we play was *very* forward thinking in contrast with what came before. We were not savages.

[Bonny Pearl]

Savages, no.....  exacting harsh judgment and sentencing due to lack of understanding/knowledge, yes.

But I'll see you your Dr. Dee and raise you Galileo, lol!  That man lived under house arrest for a good latter part of his life courtesy of the Inquisition (insert Monty Python music here lol, ) He got into trouble for his theory that the Sun was the center of the universe and that Earth traveled around it which was directly opposite of what was believed then.

Plus, The Church of England did not answer to Rome as so many other countries did in that era.


Anywhoooo, this thread is not really about Theology.  My point in bringing up old church practices as another example was to point out that enslavement comes in many forms, physical, mental, emotional, etc.  But it still boils down to one component that drove such behavior.... Power.

[LadySeasan]

I would be curious if, as some one mildly indicated previously, if black attendance would be signifficant if there was a "Kingdon of Kush or Nubia" Festival, celebrating these awesome Empires that pre-date the Renaissance.  I think it would be a great faire to check out.

Or even large Asian presence at a "Canton Faire" focusing on say Ming or Yuan Dynasty life and times.

Seems that we European types dwell on our history and take active pleasure in recreating it.

I hate to bust your bubble, but even if there were a festival of sorts, where awesome African empires were the focus, there would still be a very low number of black people in attendances.  As I said in one of my earlier posts, education is not something that is really pushed for in the typical black community. Now of course there are those who stand out, but in general, most black communities don't pride education as they should. So with that, most black people do not even know of the Kush or Nubian empires, which is a sad thing indeed.

[Capt Robertsgrave Thighbiter]

That is a shame. I learned about those empires doing a pitch paper for a film series I called " Every 100 Years", which looked at civilization at various key locations around the world every hundred years, from 2000 BC to 1000 AD, to see what changed and what new developements had taken place.

Certainly modern Western history courses don't dwell much on those cultures.

[will paisley]

I hate to bust your bubble, but even if there were a festival of sorts, where awesome African empires were the focus, there would still be a very low number of black people in attendances.  As I said in one of my earlier posts, education is not something that is really pushed for in the typical black community. Now of course there are those who stand out, but in general, most black communities don't pride education as they should. So with that, most black people do not even know of the Kush or Nubian empires, which is a sad thing indeed.

I'm not sure this is related, but when I used to work in Southwest, I remember seeing a couple of "African" shops, which were very popular.  What struck me as odd is how much of the merchandise was simply labeled "Africa" (especially the pullover knit hats with the red, yellow and green).  There was nothing identified as being from a particular country, region or even tribe; everything was "African".  The other thing I noted was that busts of Nefertiti and "pictures" of Cleopatra were popular (all portrayed as black, and some with her hair in cornrows), along with the slogan "Before there was, We Were".  From the looks of it, it seemed that not only did the patrons of these stores not know much about African history, but what they did know was false (and if the store owners knew, they didn't care). 

[VIII]

Appreciate the info, VIII !  Can't wait to read up on Black Ellen.

The history states that knights would joust in her honor for the reward of a kiss from her 'fulsome lips' and the losers would have to kiss her,... well,...  you know.

[DonaCatalina]

I don't know personally what the reason is but most playtrons I know are white.
Alessandro de Medici was half black.
I think people of color might be more interested in the renaiisance if they knew that many important characters were not of anglo-saxon-roman descent.
High school history glosses so many details that sometimes the ones you might identify with gets glossed over.
Louis XIII was 9 years old when he was crowned and by fifteen his word was law in France (yes I know about Richilieu). Point that out to a fifteen year old boy you know and see his eyes light up. I guarantee from that moment French history will look different to him.

[fortryllelsestudios]

This is a really interesting thread.  I always think its so interesting to see cultural influences in peoples garb, whether it be scandinavian, asian, celtic, spanish, moorish, slavic, african etc ad infinitum.  It enriches the experience so much whether it is accurate or not.  But it is fantasy.  I love wearing garb inspired by other cultures that are not my own heritage.  I would love for more people to find the experience fun and as exciting as I do.  I dont know if because the theme tends to be an english village is offputting to some?  I hope not.  Maybe they just think we are too white and nerdy.

[Baron Dacre]

I don't know personally what the reason is but most playtrons I know are white.
Alessandro de Medici was half black.
I think people of color might be more interested in the renaiisance if they knew that many important characters were not of anglo-saxon-roman descent.

Southern has a gentleman playing Alessandro son (Guilio de Medici).