Women's Tartan Etiquette?

[Rosamundi]

Hullo, all,

All opinions are welcome on this one . . . I'm probably essaying a Highland Games festival this summer. I'd like to go garbed, but I can't claim any clan affiliation. A quick Google search reveals a mess of "tartan etiquette" but nothing very clear, especially for women.

Is there such thing as a generic tartan? :-) Failing that, would I offend if I assembled a nice more-or-less-HA costume that may inadvertently include a clan's tartan?

[Tammy]

I would also be highly interested in what others have to say about this.

[crazyrennie]

Most people are utilizing the Black Watch tartan as a "generic" tartan.
Technically, the Black Watch (always two words) tartan is actually known as "Government Sett" and is a military tartan, although the tartan is essentially the same as the Campbell Old Sett, since the Campbells played a hand in the raising of the regiment back in the 1730's. The Government sett is "universal" in the fact that at one time, the British Army wanted to have all Scottish regiments wear it, rather than the individual regimental tartans.

Nowadays the Black Watch is readily available for civilian wear, but its origins are military.

It is interesting to note that three military tartans, worn by Highland Regiments, have now become standard clan tartans: the Gordon, Mackenzie of Seaforth and the Cameron of Erracht.

[Merlin]

Get a Black Watch.



I'm lucky enough to be allowed 2 tartans since the treaty between my clan and the Keiths.


Check out USA Kilts here http://www.usakilts.com/store/semitrad_kiltpage.php for a list of "Universal Tartans".

Tell Rocky that I sent ya !

[Mairghread]

The whole clan owning a tartan pattern thing is a Victorian construction, so wear whatever tartan you like and don't worry about which clan it is. 

[Rosamundi]

Aha, I knew I'd come to the right place for this question.  Thank you kindly, everyone! I will click over to Rocky's digs for certain.

[Merlin]

The whole clan owning a tartan pattern thing is a Victorian construction, so wear whatever tartan you like and don't worry about which clan it is.  

Ummm... I wouldn't do that.

It's just not respectful.

IMHO... it would be like putting on a Green Beret's uniform or a Special Forces soldiers uniform and wearing it around.
If you knew what my clan and clan Keith have been through in the past 500+ years... you might think differently.


Maybe not.

[Lady Catherine]

I think what Mairghread is saying is that a "clan specific Tartan" is a relatively "Modern" concept, modern in the timeline of the Scots. But,  I have found documentation that ststes the 1700-1800s was more the timeline. As for finding one you can live with, Black Watch or even the "Irish" tartn.
My research has shown that while the colors may have stayed the same, the weave would not. Ancient looms could only produce so many of the same weave, say, enough for 12 or so kilts. Then, using the same dyes and yarns, TRIED to do the same weave, through time or money, but often did not duplicate them. if i am far off field, please tell me so.
Last year at faire, I was cast as a Scott. Searching for my costume last year, i was not able to find much documentation for women's Highland wear much before the 18th century. I found quite a bit during that time about the Arisaid.
http://www.lindaclifford.com/Arisaid.html

So, being 1578, the costume director and i found a happy medium we could agree on: Me in dress( bodice and skrt) with my clan tartan sash.

[Lady Kett]

Not a drop of Scottish ancestry here but I convinced the spousal unit to go kilted because, well, men in kilts are so darned sexy! He was in the US Navy so he has a US Navy Tartan (blue shades) and I have on order a "Flower of Scotland" sash - it's blue, we'll sort of coordinate, and I think the proper term is District Tartan or, er, there's some other name for the FoS one too, maybe commemorative?

He also has an Irish National - I have a matching sash/rosette. He has a plain black one where we can wear whatever suits us while being pirates (still undecided on what though). The next will be an Isle of Skye (another district tartan) and I'll have a matching sash of some sort.

There are several tartans that are not clan specific, but even if I saw one in a particular clan that we liked enough to wear, I think the important part is to know who the clan is and maybe to learn something about them. That way if you come across someone who IS in that clan, you can at least have a somewhat intelligent conversation.

Xmarksthescot.com is a great kilting website. You will find plenty of debate over there about clan vs non-clan wearing a tartan and a recurring theme is "wear what you want". While posts on the topic pop up in lots of places, there is a Tartans & Heraldry Forum. There are also links to sites (merchants) with registered tartans for you to peruse.

In this case, I will have to respectfully disagree with Merlin (no wizardly curses please! ). For a Ren Faire, wear what you want, just know what you're wearing.

[Merlin]

I think what Mairghread is saying is that a "clan specific Tartan" is a relatively "Modern" concept, modern in the timeline of the Scots. But,  I have found documentation that ststes the 1700-1800s was more the timeline.

Hmmm.. I guess I focused more on this part

"so wear whatever tartan you like and don't worry about which clan it is."

Not a drop of Scottish ancestry here but I convinced the spousal unit to go kilted because, well, men in kilts are so darned sexy! He was in the US Navy so he has a US Navy Tartan (blue shades) and I have on order a "Flower of Scotland" sash - it's blue, we'll sort of coordinate, and I think the proper term is District Tartan or, er, there's some other name for the FoS one too, maybe commemorative?

He also has an Irish National - I have a matching sash/rosette. He has a plain black one where we can wear whatever suits us while being pirates (still undecided on what though). The next will be an Isle of Skye (another district tartan) and I'll have a matching sash of some sort.

There are several tartans that are not clan specific, but even if I saw one in a particular clan that we liked enough to wear, I think the important part is to know who the clan is and maybe to learn something about them. That way if you come across someone who IS in that clan, you can at least have a somewhat intelligent conversation.

Xmarksthescot.com is a great kilting website. You will find plenty of debate over there about clan vs non-clan wearing a tartan and a recurring theme is "wear what you want". While posts on the topic pop up in lots of places, there is a Tartans & Heraldry Forum. There are also links to sites (merchants) with registered tartans for you to peruse.

In this case, I will have to respectfully disagree with Merlin (no wizardly curses please! ). For a Ren Faire, wear what you want, just know what you're wearing.

Once married into a clan... all tartan privileges transfer to the spouse. (and that includes military)
You look incredible in that !
I LOVE XMarkstheScot.com ! !


Oh...and by all mean... wear whatever you want. Come dressed as a storm trooper... I don't care. My comment was merely directed toward tartan etiquette. (I'm not sleeping with the dragon to place on spell on you for disagreeing with me...merely my 2 cents)

[Kate XXXXXX]

Once married into a clan... all tartan privileges transfer to the spouse. (and that includes military)


Incorrect.  Married women MAY take their husband's name, but still retain their own, to this day.  They MAY wear their husband's tartan, but are not obliged to do so, and if they do, are not obliged to give up their own.  My mother may legally go by either her own name or her husband's.  On legal documents drawn up in Scotland, both names appear thus: Axxxxxxxxxx Exxxxxxxx Txxxxxx or McRxxxxxx.

Strictly speaking, military tartans may only be worn by members of the regiment.  The right to wear it is reserved to serving and retired members of that regiment, not passed to family members.  In practice, they are often used as generic tartans, but be aware that is is merely tolerated by those regiments, as it would be too expensive to chase down and rip it off the backs and arses of all who now have some. 

Remember that there are a lot more than clan tartans about.  There is one that was designed for the Windsors, many commercial firms have them. and the Royal Naval Association has it's own.

Wear whichever you feel happiest with.  Enjoy it. 

[groomporter]

I think what Mairghread is saying is that a "clan specific Tartan" is a relatively "Modern" concept, modern in the timeline of the Scots. But,  I have found documentation that ststes the 1700-1800s was more the timeline.

Hmmm.. I guess I focused more on this part

"so wear whatever tartan you like and don't worry about which clan it is."

For Renfair purposes I've always told people to wear whatever tartan appeals to you. but...

Occasionally, some clan members at Highland games or similar events can sometimes be a bit snobbish about things -even though there are no laws in Scotland to prevent anyone wearing any clan or district tartan. One year my old Scottish reenactment group was kept out of the parade of tartans at the local Highland games, the new head of the local St Andrews Society said it was because we were not an actual "clan."

But if you are worried about it there are now dozens of official "tartans" that are not associated with specific clans, like the regional tartans http://www.men-in-kilts.com/regional-scottish-index.html

A lot of U.S. states have even adopted and registered official tartans http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._state_tartans

[groomporter]

Strictly speaking, military tartans may only be worn by members of the regiment.  The right to wear it is reserved to serving and retired members of that regiment, not passed to family members.  In practice, they are often used as generic tartans, but be aware that is is merely tolerated by those regiments, as it would be too expensive to chase down and rip it off the backs and arses of all who now have some.  

The other problem there is that historically, most of the regimental tartans other than Black Watch were also family tartans
http://www.houseoflabhran.net/militaryregimentaltartans.html so it's pretty hard to draw a line between what is a regimental tartan and what is a clan tartan. (There's apparently a debate as to whether Black Watch was based on a Campbell tartan or not)

[Dinobabe]

When making a kilt for hubby I looked into our clan tartan, McCallister.  WAY TOO EXPENSIVE!  So I went to Hancocks and found the closest generic plaid I could.
For faire I would say just go for it, for a highland games or something specific I (personally) would be a bit more careful.  Follow the advice here and you will always be safe.

[Merlin]

Once married into a clan... all tartan privileges transfer to the spouse. (and that includes military)


Incorrect.  Married women MAY take their husband's name, but still retain their own, to this day.  They MAY wear their husband's tartan,

I'm not sure how this is different.
I didn't imply that they HAD to do anything.