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Period Peerage/Social Class

Started by Element of Air, May 21, 2008, 01:13:46 PM

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DonaCatalina

Generals and Ship Captains were not automatically accorded the rank of knight or lord. But pre-1550, many of these men had that rank prior to acquiring the responsibilities of being a captain or a general.
i.e. The Earl of Oxford was a general of the forces under Henry Tudor who became Henry VII.

There are a lot of variance in the definitions of a squire, mainly because English is a polyglot language....
It also depends on what time period you are referring to. The country gentleman aspect is a little more of a Victorian thing.
squire (skwr)
n.
1. A man who attends or escorts a woman; a gallant.
2. An English country gentleman, especially the chief landowner in a district.
3. A judge or another local dignitary.
4. A young nobleman attendant upon a knight and ranked next below a knight in feudal hierarchy.
tr.v. squired, squir·ing, squires
To attend as a squire; escort.

It is a fine distinction, but in England there was Nobly born and Gently Born. The short answer is that anyone born to a titled noble was considered nobly born. But for example, the children of a Baron's second son would be considered Gently Born. Thus....Gentlemen. A Gentleman's children would also be considered Gently born.

If anyone can explain this better, please do.
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Baroness Doune


DonaCatalina

Quote from: Master James on May 21, 2008, 01:50:09 PM
Someone actually took the time to right it all up and put it on a website.  Its accurate as far as I know.  Here you go.  http://jackytappet.tripod.com/chain.html

I was always amused that they went so far as to list plants and rocks and things.
Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit
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Portrait Goddess

Rowan MacD

Quote from: DonaCatalina on December 08, 2010, 01:11:49 PM
Quote from: Master James on May 21, 2008, 01:50:09 PM
Someone actually took the time to right it all up and put it on a website.  Its accurate as far as I know.  Here you go.  http://jackytappet.tripod.com/chain.html

I was always amused that they went so far as to list plants and rocks and things.
I laughed out loud to see Actors directly below Beggers!
What doesn't kill me-had better run.
IWG wench #3139 
19.7% FaireFolk pure-80.3% FaireFolk corrupt

Monsignor de Beaumanoir

Quote from: Element of Air on May 21, 2008, 01:13:46 PM
So, I was just thinking, and it has been far to long for me to even start to recall, the statuses of Class and rankings in court and life in The Medieval/Renaissance times.

King/Queen. (obvious)
Prince/Princess
Duke/Duchess (nobleman, historically of highest rank below the King or Queen)
Marquess/Marquis/Marchioness (Ranks above an Earl and below a Duke)
Count/Countess (equivalent to Earl)
Earl (equivalent to Count)
Viscount (above Baron, below Earl/Count)
Baron/Baroness (lowest rank in the peerage)
Sir/Sire (as title of honor of a knight or baronet)
Knight (non-heritable form of gentility, but is not nobility)
Lord/Lady (aristocratic rank, control over a portion of land and produce/labor of serfs living thereon)
Serf (slave or peasant under rule of a Lord)
Page (Apprentice, assistant, young errand boy)
Squire (young man who aspired to the rank of knighthood and who served an existing knight as his attendant or shield carrier)


This all sort of gets bent out of shape when you review the 12-13 Century period of the Medieval period, with the development of the Military Orders, not to mention the complete absence of the Church's representatives (You could twist this even further with the geographical interpretations of "said" developments: see Iberian Orders)

It might look like:

Pope
King/Queen, Grand Master of the Order
Local Bishops
Marshal of the Order
Prince/Princess
Duke/Duchess, Commanders of the various lands occupied by the Orders
Marquess/Marquis/Marchioness
Count/Countess
Earl
Viscount
Baron/Baroness
Knight (Full vow taking Brothers of the Orders)
Lord/Lady (Confreres-members serving Orders for a set time, no vows taken)
Sergeants (members serving Orders, no previous knightly title)
Turcopoles(members serving Orders, local national recruitment)
Serf (slave or peasant under rule of a Lord)
Page (Apprentice, assistant, young errand boy)
Squire (served an existing knight as his attendant)


Elizabeth Talbot, Countess of Shrewsbury

Wow, I never knew all that! This is interesting.
Castleteer
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DonaCatalina

Quote from: Baroness Doune on May 27, 2008, 08:14:28 PM
Useful links:
Titles and Forms of Address
http://elizabethan.org/compendium/13.html

Correct Forms of Address
http://www.chinet.com/~laura/html/titles12.html



Scarborough Faire has a lecture on History, Customs and Manners. Many of their weekly subjects touch upon this aspect of life pre-1600.
Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit
Marquesa de Trives
Portrait Goddess