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Author Topic: Machine - can it still be h/a?  (Read 4622 times)

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Offline operafantomet

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Re: Machine - can it still be h/a?
« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2008, 09:52:39 AM »
So that corset is stunning, but looking at your pic of it, I'm wondering about the arm holes.  Is this a pic of the front or back?  Is it just an optical illusion, cause it seems the arms are not on the side per say...
No, it's the backside. The front is actually even more beautiful:
http://www.staylace.com/gallery/gallery07/1662_ancosta_front.jpg

The silhouette of the mid/late 1600's required a "pushed-back" shoulder area, but I think the narrow cut of the back and the broadness of the upper sleeves are a bit deceiving in the photo. It is a bit extreme, but not as extreme as it comes off (or would come off on a human being), as far as I can tell.

ETA: bottom of this page: http://www.staylace.com/gallery/gallery07/index.html claims that people has made faithful replicas (V&A - or someone connected to them - has released a rather exact pattern), and that they found the corset both wearable and comfortable. The site above sais the sleeves are a (later?) addition, for winter wear. I dunno.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2008, 09:54:37 AM by operafantomet »

Offline Kate XXXXXX

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Re: Machine - can it still be h/a?
« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2008, 12:40:45 PM »
That's the back.  Here's the whole thing: http://collections.vam.ac.uk/objectid/O10446

And there's a pattern for it here: http://www.patternsoftime.com/proddetail.asp?prod=RC711

Offline gem

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Re: Machine - can it still be h/a?
« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2008, 03:11:03 PM »
The "set-backness" like that of sleeves (for lack of a better term! LOL) was very common in 17th/18th century garb--even my caraco looks close to that, with the armscye curved more toward the back than the side--and it has to do with how the corset shapes the posture.  You would be surprised how *amazingly* comfortable it is to have your shoulders drawn gently back like that--particularly in today's world of slumped-over computer posture!

Offline TiaLD77

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Re: Machine - can it still be h/a?
« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2008, 07:58:42 AM »
Somethign to keep in mind for pieces like this is for that era folks were not as Physical in the higher classes the arms were not usually Raised above shoulder level even whan dancing, Gestures were small an coantained, things moved at a much slower pace. so while I wouldnt wear it for playign tennis, I bet it is darn comfy for sitting through an afternoon tea or an opera.
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Offline LadyElizabeth

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Re: Machine - can it still be h/a?
« Reply #19 on: October 09, 2008, 09:24:03 AM »
How fascinating and informative.  I totally get how that could be comfortable now.  I do tend to slouch in my corsets sometimes just because that's how they are...  Thanks for clearing that up.
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Offline mollymishap

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Re: Machine - can it still be h/a?
« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2008, 06:14:23 PM »
Well, it may be that this is one of those "depends on the activity" situations...I made a similar boned bodice cut to a c. 1660's pattern in one of Janet Arnold's books for a part I played, and I found it most uncomfortable to wear...now it could well be that if I hadn't been in a very active and physical role that demanded free arm movement, I would have been fine.

So, maybe the moral of the story is not only to be concerned about whether the construction method and pattern is h/a, but to consider what activities the particular style of clothing would be most suited for. 

I made a Henrician Tudor gown with those great big furry sleeves about a year or so ago, and I tell you: unless I plan on attending a banquet where I'd be mostly sitting, I dont' think I could wear that gown to faire for a whole day without ending up needing some Alleve by the end of it. 

Some syles were just meant for pretty and are really rather impractical to wear--then and now, come to think of it!

Offline LadyElizabeth

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Re: Machine - can it still be h/a?
« Reply #21 on: October 10, 2008, 08:49:23 AM »
The only part of my garb that I find very physically uncomfortable would be my huge neck ruff and my big neck whisk.  It completely restricts head movement such that by the end of the day I'm just dying to move my head back or turn my head without turning my whole body!!  I can't imagine the Elizabethans wearing those ruffs on a daily basis, unless at court or at an official function...
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Offline Miranda

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Re: Machine - can it still be h/a?
« Reply #22 on: October 10, 2008, 04:50:53 PM »
Quote
I can't imagine the Elizabethans wearing those ruffs on a daily basis, unless at court or at an official function...
More than likely that's exactly when were worn.
I imagine going to Court then was rather like going to the Oscars today.
It's only on the rarest of occasions that we get the Elizabethan equivalent of People Magazines' "Star Tracks."  There are examples out there of what the upper class wore on a daily basis, it just takes some digging and knowing where to look.

As for the initial question.  I'm going to rehash what has been said already. 

When I decided that accuracy was a worthwhile endeavor for me I started with silhouette and worked out.  In the beginning everything was machine sewn, including trim.  I've gotten to the point where I much prefer hand sewing my bodices, because I find it is easier to manipulate my fabrics.  Trim and other accents are hand stitched.  I avoid visible machine stitching when and where ever possible.  I still use my machine on my skirt seams and undergarments, but that is only because no one sees those.
I have actually found that I save time by sewing some things by hand.  Because I have more control, things are only done once. Rather than having to take out the seam and redo it because the velvet on my bodice puckered, trim shifted, etc.

When all is said, it really depends on your goals, what is important to you as a costumer, and any particular sewing strengths or weaknesses, as to how far you take your accuracy.
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Offline nliedel

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Re: Machine - can it still be h/a?
« Reply #23 on: October 13, 2008, 09:23:53 AM »
I do my eyelets by hand and my armholes, along with anything else I have time for. Sometimes I do and sometimes I don't. I'm just trying to be more H/A right now and worry about perfect authenticity when the kids aren't so high maintenance. I will never make a hand stitched pair of bodies, though. I know my limits.
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