Following Orders

[Lord Magnus]

Cool Videos thanks Joan!

[Sir William Marcus]

Yes! Thank you Joan for sharing and you resided in Europe at one time?

BTW, was that an "Imperial March" remix I heard on the second video?

[joan of arc]

Yes! Thank you Joan for sharing and you resided in Europe at one time?

BTW, was that an "Imperial March" remix I heard on the second video?

Yes, it was! 

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

St Joan, how goes the career in Law Enforcement?

[joan of arc]

One enemy at the time  Seriously, pretty well for now (at one point I hurt my back and was not sure if I could continue) - by God's grace. And how are you, dear brother?

St Joan, how goes the career in Law Enforcement?

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

One enemy at the time  Seriously, pretty well for now (at one point I hurt my back and was not sure if I could continue) - by God's grace. And how are you, dear brother?

St Joan,

Things have been quite busy, since the last time we exchanged information. I've swapped jobs (less travel, but still battling the enemy of old in a different manner), and have been provided more time to pursue the historical reading portion of my hobby.

Have you at this time decided to swap your divinely protected armor of plate for something more durable and functional? Like that of a Sister of one of the Military Orders of the Crusades? Maybe given your geographical background, one of the Teutonic Order or Livonian Schwert Bruder Orden?

How's the MMA treating you? Do I recall correctly that you were also a member of ARMA?

A few of the Sisters on this thread would welcome your presence.....lol!

BTW: The lass I was referring to from Russia goes by the moniker of "Darkmatter". She does a lot of photography for that particular group.

[joan of arc]

My ballistic vest does not quite compare with plate armor, I would not mind wearing it for the job 

I don't have enough time to do ARMA, but MMA is going well!

I will be going to a new Texas faire (Sherwood forest), as a Crusader (Templar)

One enemy at the time  Seriously, pretty well for now (at one point I hurt my back and was not sure if I could continue) - by God's grace. And how are you, dear brother?

St Joan,

Things have been quite busy, since the last time we exchanged information. I've swapped jobs (less travel, but still battling the enemy of old in a different manner), and have been provided more time to pursue the historical reading portion of my hobby.

Have you at this time decided to swap your divinely protected armor of plate for something more durable and functional? Like that of a Sister of one of the Military Orders of the Crusades? Maybe given your geographical background, one of the Teutonic Order or Livonian Schwert Bruder Orden?

How's the MMA treating you? Do I recall correctly that you were also a member of ARMA?

A few of the Sisters on this thread would welcome your presence.....lol!

BTW: The lass I was referring to from Russia goes by the moniker of "Darkmatter". She does a lot of photography for that particular group.

[Femme Falchion]

I will be going to a new Texas faire (Sherwood forest), as a Crusader (Templar)

Please be sure to post your pictures on this thread!  A female Templar warrior will be quite pleasing to behold!

[joan of arc]

I will - once I pull my gear out of the crates!

I will be going to a new Texas faire (Sherwood forest), as a Crusader (Templar)

Please be sure to post your pictures on this thread!  A female Templar warrior will be quite pleasing to behold!

[Lady Christina de Pond]

  Merry Christmas Yall 

[Lord Magnus]

One of my favorite legends to read, while not a true "Christmas story" but one that fits the area is the legend of Prester John:


In the 1130s, under the leadership of Imad ad-din Zengi, Turkish power became a serious threat to the Crusader kingdoms in the Holy Land. This caused these kingdoms to seek aid from Western Europe, and around 1145, Hugh, Bishop of Jabala, was sent to meet Pope Eugenius to ask for help. Otto von Freisingen, Bishop of Freising, recorded in his Historia de Duabus Civitatibus (1158) that Hugh told the Pope about Prester John, a Christian priest and king whose kingdom was in the extreme Orient, beyond Persia and Armenia. Prester John was supposed to be a descendent of the Magi and a possessor of great wealth. It appears that Hugh talked to the Pope about Prester John because rumors had been circulating in Europe that he was going to come to the rescue of the Crusader kingdoms and Hugh wasn't to emphasize that this would not happen as Prester John was cut off from the Middle East by the Tigris River.
In 1165, a (forged) letter allegedly from Prester John was delivered to Emperor Manuel Comnenus of Byzantium. Manuel forwarded the letter to Emperor Frederic Babarous of the Holy Roman Empire. The forgery was quite clever, for the forger had obviously read Otto von Freisingen's report and he repeated many of the same stores and further played upon the hopes and fears of the Europeans vis-à-vis the infidel Turks. The letter caused a sensation and not only were copies circulated widely, but excepts were even put to song.

Excerpts from letter

"...I, Prester john, who reign supreme, surpass in virtue, riches and power all creatures under heaven. Seventy kings are our tributaries. I am a zealous Christian and universally protect the Christians of our empire, supporting them by our alms. We have determined to visit the sepulchre of our Lord with a very large army, in accordance with the glory of our majesty to humble and chastise the enemies of the cross of Christ and to exalt his blessed name."

"For gold, silver, precious stones, animals of every kind and the number of our people, we believe there is not our equal under heaven."

"If again thou askest how it is that the Creator of all having made us the most superpotential and most glorious over all mortals-does not give us a higher dignity or more excellent name than that of Priest (Prester), let not thy wisdom be surprised on this account, for this is the reason. We have many ecclesiastics in our retinue of more dignified name and office in the Church, and of more considerable standing than ours in the divine service. For our house-steward is a patriarch and king; our cup-bearer is an archbishop and king; our chamberlain is a bishop and king; our archimandrite, that is chief pastor or master of the horse, is a king and abbot. Whereof our highness has not seen it repugnant to call himself by the same name and to distinguish himself by the order of which our court is full. And if we have chosen to be called by a lower name and inferior rank, it springs from humility."



The only official response to the letter was that Pole Alexander III sent out a Papal emissary in 1177 with a letter for Prester John, carried by his physician, Magister Philippos, but nothing was ever heard of what became of him. Years later, in the mid-thirteenth century when Asia was opened again to Europeans by the ascendancy of the Tartars, the great search began to find this Prester John, a search which was very important opening up Asia and re-establishing ties with China. Though he was never found, his legend continued throughout the middle ages, with Kings and Popes sending off letters at different times seeking his help and dreams of his riches filling the heads of many.

For more on the legend just google "Prester John" and you will bring up a multitude of information about him.

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

In 1221 Jacques de Vitry, Bishop of Acre, returned from the disastrous Fifth Crusade with good news: King David of India, the son or grandson of Prester John, had mobilized his armies against the Saracens. He had already conquered Persia, then under the Khwarezmian Empire's control, and was moving on towards Baghdad as well. This descendant of the great king who had defeated the Seljuks in 1141 planned to reconquer and rebuild Jerusalem.

The bishop of Acre was correct in thinking that a great King had conquered Persia; however "King David," as it turned out, was no benevolent Nestorian monarch nor even a Christian, but the pagan warlord Genghis Khan. His reign took the story of Prester John in a new direction. The Mongol Empire's rise gave Western Christians the opportunity to visit lands they had never seen before, and they set out in large numbers along the Empire's secure roads. Belief that a lost Nestorian kingdom existed in the east, or that the Crusader states' salvation depended on an alliance with an Eastern monarch, was one reason for the numerous Christian ambassadors and missionaries sent to the Mongols.

The link between Prester John and Genghis Khan was elaborated upon at this time as the Prester became identified with Genghis' foster father, Toghrul, king of the Keraits, given the Jin title Wang Khan Toghrul. Fairly truthful chroniclers and explorers such as Marco Polo, Crusader-historian Jean de Joinville, and the Franciscan voyager Odoric of Pordenone stripped Prester John of much of his otherworldly veneer, portraying him as a more realistic earthly monarch. Joinville describes Genghis Khan in his chronicle as a "wise man" who unites all the Tartar tribes and leads them to victory against their strongest enemy, Prester John. According to Marco Polo's Travels, the war between the Prester and Genghis started when Genghis, new ruler of the rebellious Tartars, asked for the hand of Prester John's daughter in marriage. Angered that his lowly vassal would make such a request, Prester John denied him in no uncertain terms. In the war that followed, Genghis triumphed and Prester John perished.

The historical figure behind these accounts, Toghrul, was in fact a Nestorian Christian monarch defeated by Genghis. He had fostered the future Khan after the death of his father Yesugei and was one of his early allies, but the two had a falling out. After Toghrul rejected a proposal to wed his son and daughter to Genghis' children, the rift between them grew until war broke out in 1203. Genghis captured Toghrul's daughter Sorghaghtani Beki and married her to his son Tolui; they had several children, including Möngke, Kublai, Hulagu, and Ariq Böke.


Wolfram von Eschenbach tied the history of Prester John to the Holy Grail legend in his poem Parzival, in which the Prester is the son of the Grail maiden and the Saracen knight Feirefiz.

[Lord Magnus]

Awww ya spoiled it.. well sort of    ... I was hoping the rest of order would go and hunt down that the Mongols ( one of my favorites) were a deciding factor in this and so many other events dealing with Amu Darya ( Transoxianna? ) Christians then.... 

Warrior Monk,I ask your aid in this. Later it seems Prester John's kingdom in the 1400's switched to East Africa.. I know that he was the supposed king of the "Three Indias" How did they determine that  East Africa was an "India" considering that both Egyptian and Roman trade routes where still used via the Islamic Empires or trade so the knowledge of these lands still existed?

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

It appears they (Franks/Westerners) often spoke of the "Three Indias," and add to this the lack of any real geographical/nautical knowledge of the Indian Ocean, they sometimes considered Ethiopia one of the three. The Franks/Crusaders knew Ethiopia was a powerful Christian nation, but any contact had been sporadic since the rise of Islam. Since no Prester John was to be found in Asia, European imagination moved him around the blurred frontiers of "India" until they found an appropriately powerful kingdom for him in Ethiopia.

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

Can somebody tell me where I might find a helmet such as this?