Kilts Invented by an Englishman

[Seanfromscotland]

Yes, the celts were a language and cultural group that originated in what is now modern day germany/austria/switzerland.

People regard the scots and irish as modern celts, which is made up fantasy. The scot and irish are NOT celtic and they have not been celtic for nearly 1200 years. The elts for some reaosn are considered as a racial group which is so far wrong that it flabbergasts me. The scots are not even a racial group themselves. I have never described my self as celtic and I would not describe scotland or ireland or any other nation for that matter as a celtic nation. A lot of people would have you believe that the ancient celts listened to fiddle music, drank guiness and wore kiss me im irsh badges.

Clling the scots or irish celts in the 21st century is like calling the germans goths or the itlaians romans.

[Julianne]

Please keep this discussion on topic. 
Thank you.

[SirRichardBear]

If you want to wear the kilt do so, stop making claims to the kilt in order to justify yourselfs wearing it, because you do not need to. Anyone should wear the kilt, wether they are american, german, english, french etc. Thank you

Seanfromscotland Sorry you are so thin skin.  I wear the kilt because I want to and because I have ancestors from Scotland.  I don't need to justify it to you or anyone else and never do. 

My point was that the kilt and the small kilt were worn by Scotish Highlanders and not invented by the English.  That while serving in America they were known to wear both and made a point in orders, letters, and diaries that they often cut down thier kilts into small kilt.  Given the old history of Scot's serving in America since the early colonial period and many of the founding bothers being from Scotland the kilt is very American.  After all Scotish lowlanders didn't wear the kilt yet you still say the kilt is Scottish.   

And if a soldier majorly changed his uninform it would be known as xy version.  For example the China Marine uninform was different than the standard Marine uniform of the period and was known as such.

[Julianne]

Indeed.

Scottish Americans are very proud of their ancestral heritage. 
Doning the kilt or arisaidh is our way of identifying with that most American and Scottish proclomation, "I'm Freeeeeee"

And it certainly is a great display of American love of Scotland and it's peoples worldwide.

[Scotsman]

A rose by any name would not smell as sweet eh?

My, I don't recognise the name, Seanfromscotland, but indeed I do recognise the tone ...

Shame we can't keep our comments on subject lest we take others to task. Your concerns about your heritage may be well founded cousin, but you lack of concern for the heritage of others in insulting. If I may, please exercise tact for you have not walked a mile in their shoes.

[groomporter]

I get angry when I read of ridiculous claims to the kilt by the welsh, cornish, and even the austrians.

That's right! I forgot there was someone recently claiming an Austrian  origin for the kilt.  ( http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1069623/posts )

The silly claim was just based on the fact that they found some tartan-patterned fabric in Austria that was older than any previously found in Europe. Sorry, but there's more to a kilt than checquered cloth.

[SirRichardBear]

Tartan is a combination of weave and plaid you need both.  After all a Italian table cloth is plaid but isn't tartan. 

Many culture used the tartan weave and had plaid cloth, many used the material in clothing.  Just as many cultures from the middle east to the Pacific Island men wear single clothing. But it was in the Highland of Scotland that they were put togeather in a certain fashion to make the kilt.   Just as today Americans are adding back pockets and cargo pockets etc making a distinctive American version of the kilt.

[Seanfromscotland]

If you want to wear the kilt do so, stop making claims to the kilt in order to justify yourselfs wearing it, because you do not need to. Anyone should wear the kilt, wether they are american, german, english, french etc. Thank you

Seanfromscotland Sorry you are so thin skin.  I wear the kilt because I want to and because I have ancestors from Scotland.  I don't need to justify it to you or anyone else and never do. 

My point was that the kilt and the small kilt were worn by Scotish Highlanders and not invented by the English.  That while serving in America they were known to wear both and made a point in orders, letters, and diaries that they often cut down thier kilts into small kilt.  Given the old history of Scot's serving in America since the early colonial period and many of the founding bothers being from Scotland the kilt is very American.  After all Scotish lowlanders didn't wear the kilt yet you still say the kilt is Scottish.   

And if a soldier majorly changed his uninform it would be known as xy version.  For example the China Marine uninform was different than the standard Marine uniform of the period and was known as such.

I never asked for you to justify yourself wearing the kilt. I am open to anyone wearing scotlands national dress.

The kilt is NOT american, the kilt has nothing to do with america. The kilted regiments fought with the british army extensivly all over the world. By your logic that would make it the kilt belgian (waterloo), indian (colonial india), african (colonial africa: south africa etc.).

How can you say that the kilt is american just because some of the founding fathers had scots ancestry, or that the kilt is amerian merely because the scots fought in america. Your statement is absurd and ridiculous. And frankly it is these obnoxious kinds of statements that make scots loathe some of the american contingant with scots ancestry.

and for the record I have never registered to this forum, you may check my i.p address.

amerians are welcome to learn about scottish culture, however it is scottish culture that is what I live in and breathe in everday. It is not american culture it is scottish culture.

[DeadBishop]

Seanfromscotland, please do not take this discussion off topic again.  You have been warned twice.  Please read the Forum Guidelines concerning Trolling and Arguing.

[Poldugarian Warrior]

Well, let me say this. SeanfromScotland is correct in his statement that the kilt is a truly Scottish garment. And just because the type of garment was worn by American and British troops around the world during their campaigns, it doesn't make it an American,Indian,African, or Middle Eastern garment.

I for instance am of Polish, Dutch, and Hungarian descent. So I could wear a kilt, but I can't claim. Yeah, I'm wearing a Polish kilt." That'd make me an idiot because evryone knows kilts are and were invented by the Scots, and no matter where you are in the world it doesn't make it that nation's kilt.  To sum things up there are no American kilts. Kilts were invented by the Scots after long rule by the Romans whom liked the functionality of the kilt, and the English always tried to outlaw the wearing of the kilt, until they started to bend the rules a bit, then kilts were popular again and the rest is history.

And thanks to SirRichardBear for clearing up the whole Tartan/Plaid relation. I always wondered what the difference was.

So go on and wear a kilt remember it was invented by the Scots, and many men wore them around the world during their adventures.

[groomporter]

That'd make me an idiot because evryone knows kilts are and were invented by the Scots, and no matter where you are in the world it doesn't make it that nation's kilt.  To sum things up there are no American kilts.

To muddy the waters and play Devil's Advocate however... 
I would call the Utilitkilt (and some of it's copiers) an "American Kilt", but then again, it is a non-traditional, non-tartan "neo-kilt." 

-there are also some official "American" tartans.
Several U.S. states have adopted their own official tartans
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._state_tartans.
http://www.scottish-wedding-dreams.com/american-state-setts.html
Minnesota's was approved by our state senate in 2002. There was even a (rather homely) red white and blue American Bicentennial tartan.

One nice thing about these is that they are relatively new option for people who want a kilt, but don't want to wear a tartan that's not connected with their family. (-Not that anyone actually regulates that)

[SirRichardBear]

Don't forget than the US military have their own Tartans. 

[groomporter]

Oh that's right... practically everyone has a tartan these days.

[SirRichardBear]

I tend to think of kilts somewhat like jeans.  Blue Jeans were invented in America and in the 1950's and 1960's something of an American cultural uniform.  Now days they are worn around the world and other cultures have made major changes to them.  So while they were invented in America they are no longer just American garments.   I think of the Kilt as the same invented in Scotland but they are not longer just Scottish garments.

[groomporter]

I think that's a very good way to put it!