Pirates and Renfaire - Your Thoughts.

[Noble Dreg]

I'm cool with it.

What I am deadly tired of is all the "Zombie Jacks" I see (my term for them anyway).  I'm sure you've seen them.  They dress like Ol' Jack Sparrow but don't have the drunken drag queen walk down so they walk with their hands extended in front of them like a T-rex...unmoving.

Personally I like to see Pirates in waist coats, Gypsies in bangly scarves, Scotsmen in pleated kilts, Noble gentry in bright hose and Ladys in over the top bodices.  Love the Fae and fantasy folk too.  And still I truly appreciating the HA garb too!  It's all "Rennie" and I love it!

I do dislike Sci-Fi types at fest but won't make a deal of it.

[Don Giovanni de' Medici]

Ciao,

There are some well noted points here.  And I think it is true that many people enjoy the pirates era.  I saw something in another thread to that did mention as we have in here that pirate=money, and it is true.  Since there are so popular, especially now, vendors will stock the merchandise that sell and in turn it can be seen around the sites.

I have never been a complete HA garber, I will admit.  As an actor I try to do as much research as possible to make something as close to the period as possible, but there is the unsaid rule that, "What the audience cannot see, does not betray the effect" (i.e. a hidden zipper on and undergarment or something to that effect).  There is a certain element of show that is observed and the conventions that go with it.  I guess what I was getting at with the OP is that, when I go to a Pirate Faire I like to play a member of society from that century (normally a HMRN Officer), if I go to Renfaire I want to wear something from the 16th Century.  I don't think it is a question of whether it is the definition of the type of show, whether being entertainment (Faire), or historical (Reenactment).  While there is a difference that is not the issue here really.

Again, to each their own and I am glad that everyone has a good time when they come out, that is indeed the most important thing.  I guess I would just like to see some more ideas from the renaissance that are overlooked at various venues coming back to the shows (Commedia dell'Arte, Alchemists, Inventors, Visiting Nobility, Members of the Church, Yeomen, and the like).

Just saying...
Vincente

P.S. Not sure about playtrons, but I know many a performer who would much rather play lower and middle class characters as they claim them to be more fun.  Something about less rules when no one of "authority" is around leaves them open for really great and person bits of fun with guests and in the lanes.

[BLAKDUKE]

Besides, bucket boots are so damned cool! 

Besides, I'd rather look at a pirate than a noble anyday!

AAAAAWWWWWW   wenchie you hurt my feelings!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Welsh Wench]

Blakduke, you are in a class by yourself!

I'd run down the hill for you anyday.
Or meet you halfway. 

[Celtic_Fae]

P.S. Not sure about playtrons, but I know many a performer who would much rather play lower and middle class characters as they claim them to be more fun.  Something about less rules when no one of "authority" is around leaves them open for really great and person bits of fun with guests and in the lanes.

Yes, yes. Kicking peasants and beheading dissenters of the Holy Roman Empire is only so much fun in a day. After a while, they all muddy-up and their heads all roll the same. 

Though I have known nobility to have fun jumping in puddles when it rains. It's only after that you look at your garb and say, I did WHAT?!? 


Fantasy, pirate, peasant, nobility...it's all fun (albeit different shades of fun) if the faire bug has already bitten you and your garb/the weather-of-the-day combination isn't killing you. I think we can all agree that passing out is NO fun no matter who you're playing.

I guess I would just like to see some more ideas from the renaissance that are overlooked at various venues coming back to the shows (Commedia dell'Arte, Alchemists, Inventors, Visiting Nobility, Members of the Church, Yeomen, and the like).

Indeed, yes!

To answer your original post: It is more the mindless Jack Sparrow copycats that bug me more than later-era-pirate characters who actually take the initiative to develop their own personality. It's not so much even H/A pirate vs. later pirate: Just give whatever you do some flair/personality and not just use it as an excuse to get drunk and then harass others.

It would be nice to see more Renaissance characters.

[Count Adolfo]

I concur with Kathryn... I am more perturbed by those who seem to lack even a shred of originality... than those who are anachronistic in their timeline choices.
As for visiting Nobility, my friend... you're stuck with me

[Count Adolfo]

Besides, bucket boots are so damned cool! 

They certainly get my attention. Besides, I'd rather look at a pirate than a noble anyday!
Their hats are better, too! 

Just for that, I am going to have the MOST AMAZING hat put together...



ahem...

Yeah, the truth can be painful. 

[Adriana Rose]

I have seen enough Jack clones to make me wanna hurt something!

But this summer I got into a pinch this summer and had to shanghi a friend of mine to work for a bit. I sell garlands so there ya go but my friend dresses like a pirate he pulled more girls is just stand there than me hawking my brains out!

But I like the pirate element at fair thats what I dress as when i am not at my shop so there ya go..

I am getting paged by an angry 2 year old so I must leave it at that

[Don Giovanni de' Medici]

As for visiting Nobility, my friend... you're stuck with me

Don't you mean they are stuck with us, il mio fratello? 

[Carl Heinz]

The cold bitter truth is Pirates = $$$  (at least by a Faire production standpoint).

It's exposing a new crowd to the Faire environment and I think that something we can all appreciate. Even if the garb isn't 100% HA, oh well no-one likes the garb Nazi.

That being said I personally enjoy the unique pirates much more than the Jack Sparrow wannabes. The true pirates will continue to garb as they please long after the luster of those movies subsides.

Pirate dollars help pay for my playpen just like we saw Star Wars characters and the ladies in the chain mail bikinis.  If it won't get you thrown into jail, wear what you want.

The 18th century garb isn't acceptable if you're a participant, but we have our own privateers and some visitors are starting to have their costumes evolve.  Sir Francis Drake as been a major theme character at RPFS for decades.

I occasionally have a bit of trouble when folks expect me to interact at an 18th century level so I generally try to have them  educate me by questioning them about where they're from, etc.

As has been pointed out, we're there to entertain, not be costume nazi's.  We have to satisfy the costume department and be in character, ourselves.  Visitors don't have that requirement. and it's really counter productive and hurts the event to try to make it so.

After all, I'm rolling around on probably the biggest anachronism at faire.

[Carl Heinz]

I have seen enough Jack clones to make me wanna hurt something!

Making a game of it can be interesting--something like a scavenger hunt.  How many Captain Jacks have you seen in the last hour, etc.

[Adriana Rose]

We played Slap Jack

Its like slug bug but with Jacks it was fun!

[Lady_Claira]

Well - Pirate or not, I think it is mostly in good fun.

My first experience with being a patron at faire was only three years ago. Since then I can still count all the times I have ever been to faire on one hand and not yet use all my fingers. (Though I will finally add the fifth finger next weekend - HUZZAH)

In that time I have seen incredibly convincing Jack Sparrow, Jack Sparrow who ordered their costume online and can't act to save his life, scotsmen, kilted pirates, knights, wenches, nobles, elves, etc... I personally love the history of the renaissance, but I also love pirates and the sea, and then I turn around an LARP as an elf. So I see and love all aspects of the faire. What drew me in so much was not the perfect historical accuracies in it.

I like historical accuracies, don't get me wrong. It's part of the reason I love places like Colonial Williamsburg or Plymouth Plantation. But at the same time I loved being in an environment that had many things I loved and had people that didn't care who I was in a sense that, they weren't going to pick on me for not fitting in. They accepted me for who I was, historically acurate or not and that was very welcoming.

So to me? Who cares which period of pirate arrives. As long as you have some of the historical characters as well, you have a very welcoming environment with something that most everyone can enjoy!

[Count Adolfo]

As for visiting Nobility, my friend... you're stuck with me

Don't you mean they are stuck with us, il mio fratello? 

si, mio fratello, mi dispiace!  Non ho pensato!

[jcbanner]

Are the pirates I see at most renfaires accurate? No. but are they having fun? I hope so. Thats what they pay to get in for.  The pirates aren't the worst that you can see at a faire.  from the stories I've heard from friends working at other faires around the country, the Sparrow wannabe's are more accurate then the majority of the cast at select fairs. At least pirates did exist in pre-industrial European culture at some point.  Some of the characters I've heard about don't even exist in the stories.  Lets face it, some faires are more H/A then others, some, H/A doesn't even enter the equation.

It's faire, not SCA.  

Sorry for straying off topic but I have to say that I've not found the SCA to be that different from faire as far as garb goes. You have a few in fabulous historically accurate garb, you have those (like me) who are trying but still have a long way to go, and you have more than you might think who are dressed in what we think of as the typical ren faire garb. The only real difference is that everyone is in some kind of garb. No one wandering about in jeans and a t-shirt. I personally feel like the SCA is sort of the middle ground between faire and the re-enactment groups where everyone is trying to recreate a specific time and place with very high standards for garb and equipment.

I'll admit, there are some SCA members who are VERY good at the historical research and make very impressive outfits and recreations of the trades. Despite that though I'm unsure how the SCA got a reputation as being a standard of accuracy for middle ages and Renaissance living history. For as many of the gems that put in all the effort of accuracy, I've met many more that have fully interpretive theories about what "could have been" and claim, "if they would have known about it, they would have used it" I work at an educational renfaire and work very hard at creting an H/A appearance to the faire grounds and an accurate presentaion of how things were done.  its hard for me to take seriously someone who points out "Thats not historically accurate!" when they are wearing garb made from polyester fleece and come from a group that host an online directory that has instructions on how to make armor from stopsigns and old computer cases, and how to make "historically accurate candles" by buying cheep candles from walmart and heating them in water to give them a more irregular look.  </end rant>

BACK TO THE PIRATES!!

If you think there are a bunch of jack look-a-likes at a renfaire, you should head to St Louis for our 3 weekend Pirate festival that starts in 2 weeks.  One year there were so many Jack Sparrows running around, you could toss a rock across the road and hit at least 4 before the rock hit the ground!