So, I'm learning embroidery and have started a triangle medallion to applique to my most recent bodice in progress. I have a border done, but am wondering if I can just "invent" some image to place in the center, or are there rules? Does anyone have any resources/examples I can use as references?
There are a ton of rules. :-D Since you are doing a heraldic work it sounds like, you might want to check out the SCA's Heraldic lessons pages:
http://heraldry.sca.org/laurel/lessons/
They go off the 15th C heraldic rules, I think. I know that all the rules are based on a historical period set of heraldry rules. It's a good jumping off point, in nothing else.
Prior to the 1580's - and really well up to 1600- most embroidery was monochrome. Not all, certainly, but you don't see much multi colored embroidery work prior to then. The few examples of polychrome embroidery are heraldic, meant for curtains/hangings, or in purses. (Not a set rule, but most embroidery prior to 1580 was Blackwork of some sort)
Hope that helps!
(http://www.russianpaintings.net/upload1/author/allori/Allori_Alessandro_-_Portrait_of_Eleonora_Dinora_da_Toledo_-_The_State_Hermitage_Museum_2_large.jpg)
Eleonora de Toledo State Hermitage Museum circa 1560. Embroidered doublet bodice.
Quote from: Wickedvox on July 02, 2012, 07:07:42 PM
So, I'm learning embroidery and have started a triangle medallion to applique to my most recent bodice in progress. I have a border done, but am wondering if I can just "invent" some image to place in the center, or are there rules? Does anyone have any resources/examples I can use as references?
As Isabella wrote, heraldry has lots of rules, both in terms of which colours one could combine and not ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_tincture ) and what elements to put together.
Heraldic embroidery in clothes seems to have been saved for the grand occasions in life. For general clothes motifs with hopes of a long and healthy life, or a growing family, or different virtues, seems to have been used instead. Flowers of love, beauty, modesty and fertility are frequent in camicias and jackets from the late 16th and early 17th century.
Lots of examples on this can be found in "Patterns of Fashion 4" (the one dealing with underwear and accessories). The little boy's shirt with Jesus monogram and S'es, the Venetian camicia with roses, pansies, pomegranates and acorns, shirts with birds and snails... They all had symbolic value of a long, safe and prosperous life, and for virtues the wearer should possess. Repeated monograms, stilistic to the point of looking purely decorative, are also frequent.
To get to the point... I assume this was more likely to be transported into a stomacher than family heraldry. At least for general clothes not meant for weddings and triumphal celebrations. If you can, check out the PoF 4 book, it has tons and tons of closeups of period embroidery. For visual examples I only have Italian portraits, while most on this board seems to do English style(s). Here are some links still, if you wanna have a look:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v31/operafantomet/renaissanceportraits/firenze1/baldovinetti1465.jpg
Heraldic sleeve in the portrait of a 15th century Florentine bride.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v31/operafantomet/renaissanceportraits/venezia1/cariani1530ven.jpg
A vase with sprouting flowers, typically a sign of life and fertility (opposite, an empty vase is the symbol of death).
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v31/operafantomet/renaissanceportraits/venezia2/bordone1530svioletta.jpg
A rare example of an embroidered bodice. Even rarer, it seems to match the decorated pilaster to the left. I don't quite know what to make of that, but it's a darn pretty dress.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v31/operafantomet/renaissanceportraits/firenze2/bronzino1545.jpg
Though a brocade fabric and NOT embroidered (I cannot stress this enough), the large pomegranate on her chest has an embroidered feeling, and is very central to both the portrait and the dress. The pomegranate symbolize both fertility and the rebirth of Christ, and was a frequent motif used in clothes of the Virgin Mary. It's not by accident she is depicted with a young son at her side, and with a halo around her head... Propaganda portrait!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v31/operafantomet/renaissanceportraits/venezia2/veronese1560snatgalireland.jpg
I assume the stomacher/modesty panel and the shells are embroidered, while the actual dress is made of a rich brocade or damask. But for all I know the whole thing might be embroidered. The shell was a sign of baptism in Christianity, as well as child-bearing.
Quote from: DonaCatalina on July 03, 2012, 04:42:20 AM
http://www.russianpaintings.net/upload1/author/allori/Allori_Alessandro_-_Portrait_of_Eleonora_Dinora_da_Toledo_-_The_State_Hermitage_Museum_2_large.jpg
Eleonora de Toledo State Hermitage Museum circa 1560. Embroidered doublet bodice.
I frequently see that one labeled Eleonora di Toledo, but it's not the Duchess Eleonora. First and foremost because the Duchess was around 40 in 1560, and she looked thin and sick after years of consumption, rheumatism and 11 births:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v31/operafantomet/renaissanceportraits/firenze3/bronzino1560edt.jpg)
As you can see from the title of the file you posted, it has the additional name "Dianora". That was the Duchess's niece. They were both named Eleonora di Toledo, but had different nicknames: the Duchess was called "Leonora", while her niece was called "Dianora":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eleonora_di_Garzia_di_Toledo
Thank you ladies! I knew you would be the ones to go to for this! I'm going to have a lot of fun going over all this info tonight--squee!
Also if interested in period embroidery look at smocking and blackwork :D
Yeah, I've been reading about blackwork and it's too much like cross stitch to me...I hate cross stitch. Also, it looks very hard. And then I would have to find patterns and transfer them--pain. It's *very* pretty though. I think I'll stick with free form. I would love to do smocking, but that too is very time consuming, and that is a luxury I don't have right now. Maybe I'll make a blouse and experiment with it over the next year--a study break project ;)
Okay, I'm bumping my old thread so we can go through this again. I abandoned the triangle because...well...it was a triangle. It turned out pretty but, eh, just not right.
So I have a set of burgundy plain sleeves I may leave open along the back seam because I'm making a high-neck smock to wear under them. The thing--aside from that, they're very plain and so I was thinking of doing some embroidery down the top of the sleeves. Something simple a novice embroiderer can accomplish in, say, a month of Sundays.
Also, I'd like to blackwork the cuffs and collars of the high-neck smock. But as stated--novice embroiderer. I found a really great blackwork primer blog http://www.prettyimpressivestuff.com/blackwork.htm (http://www.prettyimpressivestuff.com/blackwork.htm), so I'll go over that at some point, but I need simple designs.
Ideas?? Patterns?? Resources?? I'll take 'em all lol!
Lastly--would you cut out your pieces *then* embroider? Embroider *then* cut out pieces? Assemble *then* embroider? My sleeves I plan to embroider before assembling b/c they will have a lining. But the cuffs and collar will be so small....
For colored sleeves - IE something that was not sleeves to a smock- they probably wouldn't be embroidered but rather covered in trim. The vast majority of our embroidery is from smocks and coifs. Trim could be embroidered but, depending on the station you are trying to depict, I'd go with a nice woven trim instead.
Embroider THEN cut. :) It's really hard--difficult *and* hard on the hands--to do handwork on small bits of fabric; much, much easier if you can stretch the fabric on some sort of frame. (I use spring-loaded hoops that are almost 100 years old; they are *divine!*)
Okay, so I'll research trims. It's middle-class plain curved sleeves, so nothing elaborate, if at all--right Isabella?
So Gem, trace the pattern on the fabric using tailor's chalk, then transfer the design, right? I'm making a new high-neck smock too, so even if I don't embroider the sleeves I can still use the info ;)
Thanks ladies!
Okay, this is *not* going how I planned. Questions.
Is there an easier way to transfer a design than by tracing over a light box/window/etc?? I mean aside from iron on. I've found a few tips and tricks from books/blogs, but nothing monumentally easy. I have carbon paper and will try that next.
Sooo...blackwork on evenweave--good. Without waste canvas--not so good? My design is coming out "round?" if that makes sense. Can I just keep the design on hand and compare the line length I'm stitching to number of squares on the pattern and stitch accordingly? Is that the point and I'm missing it completely lol?? *Must* I use waste canvas...or *should* I just because I'm learning and need to get used to it?
I think I'm probably answering my own questions in my head, but it's good to have confirmation. I just want to ensure I'm doing this in the easiest and most correct way.
My thumb joint is killing me.
Can you show us a picture of what you're trying to do? I am having trouble imagining where the waste canvas is coming in!
A couple of things:
1. You shouldn't need waste canvas at all if you're transferring your design to the fabric. You stitch right over the lines you're drawing. Waste canvas is for working counted designs (which you hate anyway, I thought!) on fabric you normally wouldn't embroider on, like a sweatshirt.
2. Alas, no. Transferring a design to fabric is a PITA, almost no matter what technique you use. Hence the popularity of counted work! ;) I personally find the window technique a little easier than working with my light table, but YMMV. I like to use a Sharpie, but that's a very bold choice. LOL However, I find it's a lot easier than pencil or any other made-for-fabric pencil/markers out there.
3. Evenweave should be just that--evenly woven, ie, the same number of fabric threads per inch, going in both directions (warp and weft). The term is TYPICALLY applied to fabrics to distinguish them from linen--but in reality, very nice needlework linen is also evenly woven. But because the individual linen fibers tend to vary a lot more in thickness than cotton/rayon/synthetics/etc, there can be a little more variation in the "size of an inch," if that makes sense! (Ie, 34 threads might make an inch along the weft, but maybe a little less than an inch along the warp... or the next 34 threads you count might be a little thinner/fatter, etc.)
Also, there can be a lot of variance even among "evenweaves," and some manufacturers are notorious for their fabrics being off square. (MGC Textiles, for one.) It *generally* doesn't bother me, unless I'm trying to stitch something that needs to be absolutely square, but you can definitely see in this piece (http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL417/1033223/8860218/396962628.jpg) that it looks ever-so-slightly skewed wide.
If you are doing surface embroidery (ie, not counted), then the weave or thread count of the fabric shouldn't be affecting things. My guess is that the way you have the work mounted may be pulling the design out of square. Honestly, on something that will be cut up and used as part of a garment--like a set of cuffs--by the time everything is sewn up and you're wearing them, no one will be able to tell if things are slightly wonky. But if it's really bugging you, show us a photo and we'll see if we can figure out how to fix it!
***
Ok, I just re-read your post, and it looks like maybe you're trying to turn a counted design into freehand work, or vice versa? I do think that sounds like a recipe for frustration! You absolutely do want to try & keep your stitches nice and even and about the same length each time (like with hand sewing), but I would follow the design as it is charted--either work a counted design on fabric you can count, OR choose a freehand/surface design, and stitch along the lines you've transferred.
HTH!!
Quote from: gem on January 31, 2013, 03:52:59 PM
Can you show us a picture of what you're trying to do? I am having trouble imagining where the waste canvas is coming in!
A couple of things:
1. You shouldn't need waste canvas at all if you're transferring your design to the fabric. You stitch right over the lines you're drawing. Waste canvas is for working counted designs (which you hate anyway, I thought!) on fabric you normally wouldn't embroider on, like a sweatshirt.
2. Alas, no. Transferring a design to fabric is a PITA, almost no matter what technique you use. Hence the popularity of counted work! ;) I personally find the window technique a little easier than working with my light table, but YMMV. I like to use a Sharpie, but that's a very bold choice. LOL However, I find it's a lot easier than pencil or any other made-for-fabric pencil/markers out there.
3. Evenweave should be just that--evenly woven, ie, the same number of fabric threads per inch, going in both directions (warp and weft). The term is TYPICALLY applied to fabrics to distinguish them from linen--but in reality, very nice needlework linen is also evenly woven. But because the individual linen fibers tend to vary a lot more in thickness than cotton/rayon/synthetics/etc, there can be a little more variation in the "size of an inch," if that makes sense! (Ie, 34 threads might make an inch along the weft, but maybe a little less than an inch along the warp... or the next 34 threads you count might be a little thinner/fatter, etc.)
Also, there can be a lot of variance even among "evenweaves," and some manufacturers are notorious for their fabrics being off square. (MGC Textiles, for one.) It *generally* doesn't bother me, unless I'm trying to stitch something that needs to be absolutely square, but you can definitely see in this piece (http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL417/1033223/8860218/396962628.jpg) that it looks ever-so-slightly skewed wide.
If you are doing surface embroidery (ie, not counted), then the weave or thread count of the fabric shouldn't be affecting things. My guess is that the way you have the work mounted may be pulling the design out of square. Honestly, on something that will be cut up and used as part of a garment--like a set of cuffs--by the time everything is sewn up and you're wearing them, no one will be able to tell if things are slightly wonky. But if it's really bugging you, show us a photo and we'll see if we can figure out how to fix it!
***
Ok, I just re-read your post, and it looks like maybe you're trying to turn a counted design into freehand work, or vice versa? I do think that sounds like a recipe for frustration! You absolutely do want to try & keep your stitches nice and even and about the same length each time (like with hand sewing), but I would follow the design as it is charted--either work a counted design on fabric you can count, OR choose a freehand/surface design, and stitch along the lines you've transferred.
HTH!!
Okay, I think you might be right about trying to freehand a counted design. I'm not counting the threads, I'm just following the lines and breaking it up into how many grid squares are on that line. Yeah, frustrated is a good word lol. Here's a pic:
(http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g321/TheWickedvox/CAM00194.jpg)
Or it could be the pull. I can't get the fabric to stay taught! >:( I read that wrapping it in cotton tape would help, but all I had was bias linen strips from my bodice last year:
(http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g321/TheWickedvox/CAM00195.jpg)
So, it sounds like I truly need someone to teach me cross stitch, because I really just don't get it.
Gadzooks.
Keeping fabric taut in a hoop/frame has been the bane of needlewomen for millennia! So you are definitely not alone. I like a *ridiculously* taut surface to stitch on, though I CAN adapt to something looser... but I've been stitching for 30-odd years. It's a lot easier to work with something tight. Wrapping your hoop is a good start, and the linen bias should be fine (if a little thin, perhaps. Try doubling up/doing both hoops). You could also try mounting the entire design on stretcher bars (https://www.google.com/search?q=embroidery+frame&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=OsP&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=YQILUaqlKYae2gXWpICIDQ&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA&biw=1067&bih=688#hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=kXk&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-US%3Aofficial&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=embroidery+stretcher+bars&oq=embroidery+stretcher+bars&gs_l=img.3..0i24.28378.30062.0.30245.14.6.0.8.8.0.80.454.6.6.0...0.0...1c.1.2gR5UnizgF4&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&bvm=bv.41642243,d.b2I&fp=92eb1940600b2d4a&biw=1067&bih=688) (which I have never used, but which are inexpensive & will hold something permanently taut). I know a lot of stitchers who swear by their Q-snaps (https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&sugexp=les%3Bcqn,rate_low%3D0.035,rate_high%3D0.035,min_length%3D2,cconf%3D1.2,second_pass%3Dfalse,num_suggestions%3D1,ignore_bad_origquery%3Dtrue,onetoken%3Dfalse&gs_rn=0&gs_ri=serp-qn&cp=0&tok=LjL59r23N6DAEUQrhkvlFQ&pq=q-snaps&gs_id=2i&xhr=t&q=q-snaps&client=firefox-a&hs=lF5&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&biw=1067&bih=688&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=GQMLUfP0I5S42gXHtICoBA).
Also, just using a thicker fabric to learn on is a good step, too! I worked on heavier evenweaves (Lugana, Jubliee) for years before I was comfortable with the slippier linen... now I don't even really notice the difference. (But I will say that I find it much harder to choose appropriate fabric for surface embroidery than for counted work. I'm getting better at it, though!)
Second, yes--you need to better coordinate your pattern with your technique! First thing: IF THERE ARE GRID LINES IN THE PATTERN, it's a COUNTED design. Period. :) Choose a fabric you can count on, and stitch over two threads (http://www.better-cross-stitch-patterns.com/over-two-threads.html). Making circles, etc look round is actually a *goal* of fine counted needlework, since the gridlike nature of the stitches means true roundness is impossible. (Ask me how long I've been trying to adapt the Santa Catalina embroidery (http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL417/1033223/17480040/394392194.jpg) to counted work. No, never mind, please don't. Sigh.)
And if you do go with a counted design, you won't be transferring your design onto the fabric (you work out the placement as you stitch... by counting. ;) See how that works?).
Also, I would make your stitches much, much smaller. Probably half the size they are now. The smaller the stitch, the tidier the work will look. I think you'd be happier re-tracing the design with softer lines (not so angular). In the same way that round designs are more challenging in counted work, angular designs are easier because the grid of the fabric helps support the straight stitches and crisp corners.
Is this making sense? I'm throwing a lot of information at you all at once, but I'm really trying to keep it relevant to your current task and challenges!
Okay, I see what you're saying. But I'm working on basic cotton muslin and the weave is *really* tight--if I only went over two threads at a time the cross stitch would be *super* tiny, and I can't even distinguish between threads *exasperated sigh.* I'm missing something. :-[ Some fundamental "duh" moment. I get that it's counted--start at the center and count out from the center of the design; each grid is a stitch not an increment of measure (which is what I did, so I don't understand why they're so big, except where I fudged it because all of a sudden things weren't matching); there's "X" amount of squares in a grid to an inch, but that doesn't matter(??)--should I be counting how many threads per inch of fabric? WHY IS THERE SO MUCH MATH?! Aaaaargh!! How am I supposed to embellish my costumes if I can't learn this?! :o I need someone to physically sit me down and say, "look, idjit, this is how it's done."
Sorry to take up your time... :(
Oh, here. I can make it super easy. Ready?
You can't do counted work on muslin. You just can't. Don't try it.
You need a fabric with visible holes. See this:
(http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL417/1033223/8860218/399346260.jpg)
Versus this:
(http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL417/1033223/8860218/403627458.jpg)
They're both linen. The top one is a needlework linen (http://www.hedgehoghandworks.com/catalog/fibers_LinenFabric.php), sold for that purpose. The bottom one is garment linen (the black is actually machine embroidery; the red & green is my handwork). How can you tell if fabric is suitable for counted work? It will be sold by the thread count (ie, 25-count, 36-count, etc. Those are threads per inch.).
For the two examples above... on the first one, I started with clean white fabric, and painstakingly counted each and every one of those tiny (34-to-the-inch!) threads, laying one stitch over every two fabric threads to form that octagon shape. For the second, I didn't count anything--just took my embroidery floss and filled in the motifs with satin stitch.
So I guess I would say, pick a starting point (either the fabric OR the design or...?) and let that dictate the rest. So. If you want to work on muslin, you'll need a design for surface embroidery, and you'll have to transfer that design to the fabric somehow (light table, window, iron-on, prick & pounce, etc), and you'll have to regulate the size of your stitches yourself.
If you want to do a counted design, then you need to choose a fabric you can count (you can buy needlework linen at JoAnn, Hobby Lobby, and Michael's). I suppose this is where your waste canvas could conceivably come in--but I wouldn't recommend it for your first project, not when there are many FAR easier ways to get the look you're after. Promise!
Most of the patterns for blackwork that you can find online are for counted designs. A great example of surface embroidery (non-counted) blackwork is Silverstah's coif, which you can see on her website here (http://www.silverstah.com/2012/04/22/16th-c-blackwork-coif-complete/). Can you see the difference? It's very sinuous and free-form, unlike the angular, regular look of my first example, above. This picture is teeny-tiny, but it's a great side-by-side of two period portraits:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/42/Blackwork_embroidery_1530s_and_1590s.png/220px-Blackwork_embroidery_1530s_and_1590s.png)
Counted on the left/cuff; surface on the right/sleeve.
So, to briefly re-iterate: What, exactly, do you WANT to make? Let's start from the very beginning (which in this case would be the end--the desired result), and get you off on the right foot!
*Greatful sigh!* Gem...you just don't know...do you *know* how valuable you are to have around? Seriously, I'm in tears over here. It could be the Ambien, but I am eternally grateful to you for you time and patience. I'm literally throwing projects around my sewing room thinking to myself, "One of you SOBs is going down for eternity...who's it gonna be?! Huh??"
Okay, I want to do posies and hearts blackwork for the cuffs and collar of my smock. I downloaded the pattern from that great website of blackwork examples. Don't I have to use the same fabric as my project though? I'd like something like the left cuff, but I also love silverstah's coif. I figured the collar and cuffs would be quicker than the coif, but who knows at this point. How can you help my hot mess out?
And where do you live so I can bring you a cake.
P.S. You look like the woman in Santa Catalina. Seriously.
Couldn't help overhearing, Ladies.
Just wondering about something Gem said about using a Sharpie to transfer design to a fabric. I assume you use a super fine Sharpie point. Does it show under/through the embroidery (particularly if thread is not same color as Sharpie)? What happens when it is washed? Does it disappear or bleed?
Oooh, cake! My weakness! :D
Honestly, though, Wicked--I've been where you are! Banging my head against a wall (hemp cord, anybody? Sheesh!) and totally perplexed at why something that seemed so straightforward to dozens of other seamstresses was completely eluding me. So I know how you feel, and I am delighted to help. I've had a needle in my hand as long as I can remember, but there's always something new to learn. :)
I think you'll find a counted blackwork project to be a little easier to start with, and here's A Secret: Zweigart's 28 count Antique White Cashel Linen (https://www.stitchingbitsandbobs.com/cgi-bin/Store/pageread.cgi?Cashel) (a needlework fabric you can get at Hobby Lobby, or that link takes you to a really nice online needlework store) is a perfect match color-wise to Fabrics-store.com's IL20 3.5 oz Bleached & Softened linen (http://www.fabrics-store.com/first.php?goto=big_fabric&menu=f&menu=f&fabric_id=689). This is what I've stocked up on for the Santa Catalina camicia. I have stitched straight on the Fabrics-store.com linen (I monagrammed this shift (http://elizabethcbunce.wordpress.com/historical-costuming/18th-century-middle-class-ensemble/shift-undergarments/)), so it *is* possible if a person is so inclined; the holes in the linen are visible enough to count... but it's EASIER to stitch on the Zweigart.
Needlework fabric is typically sold like quilting fabric--by "fat" measurements (http://0.tqn.com/d/quilting/1/0/3/J/-/-/fatquarters.jpg) (a "fat quarter" is still one quarter of a yard, but instead of cutting narrow strips--9" by 54" like at a fabric store, they quarter the yardage like you would a sandwich; 18"x27". That's because for most needlework you generally want a more squarish piece instead of a long skinny strip.) How much will you need for a collar/cuffs? You got me. LOL Here's where your math will come in, I'm afraid. ;)
***
To answer Polly's questions: Yes, yes & no, nothing, no. ;D I use a super-fine Sharpie and a very light touch--and either a very light color (sometimes hard to find) that will be easy to cover with the stitches, or the same color as the embroidery. If I'm uncertain at all about how things will turn out, I'll use another method (pencil--but I find pencil sometimes hard to see under my needlework lamp). The Sharpie doesn't spread through the fabric (or at least it hasn't so far on me), and it won't bleed. Mary Corbet (http://www.needlenthread.com/index.php?s=micron) (who is a far superior embroideress than little ol' I) recommends Sakura Micron pens (you can get them at any craft store), which have an even finer point than the Sharpie.
HTH!
I use good ole pencil to transfer patterns. It washes off easily after you are done with the embroidery and will also come off easily should you transfer the design incorrectly.
Okay, well, I'll try that embroidery linen. Thanks for *all* your help Gem, I really appreciate it!
So just a research question then--were *all* pieces done in black work made with embroidery grade linen??
My answers above refer to modern materials. For information on period embroidery, here's what Jacqui Carey has to say in
Elizabethan Stitches (http://www.amazon.com/Elizabethan-Stitches-Historic-English-Needlework/dp/0952322587/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1359760008&sr=8-1&keywords=elizabethan+stitches):
First, she stresses that period fabrics were all hand-woven, and that modern power-loom materials don't always replicate what was available to 16th and 17th c. embroideresses (who, she also stresses, were often professionals!).
Specifically, as to the ground fabric for embroidery, she says that linen tends to be plain-woven (a regular over-under weave), and a little finer than the examples done on silk. Interesting!
Also,
Quote...Consequently [of hand-weaving] the grid structure tends to fluctuate within a single piece of fabric, making the stitch sizes inconsistent. Howver, many of the opulent examples are so fine, with the linen equating to at least a 35-count canvas in modern materials, that such variance is barely discernable. ...Today, this might seem excessively fine, but one has to remember that textile skill was commonplace, and learnt from an early age. When this factor is combined with the importance placed on quality, it is not surprising that the linen count is so high, as this would provide the grid for more elegant needlework designs.
...I will note, however, that her example of "excessively fine" fabric count is, in fact, very normal for modern stitchers! The linen I posted above (with the blackwork example) is 34-count, and fabrics in 36- and 40-count are readily available. One difference is that typically we stitch over two fabric threads, and she seems to be implying above that period needlewomen would have worked predominantly over one... but I'm not necessarily seeing that in the photographs.
The manufacture and names of fabrics have changed so much in 500 years that it can be really difficult to know, let alone replicate, exactly *what* they were working with. Linen, in particular, was once available in much, much, much finer weaves than it is today (I believe I read once that some of the period species of flax are now extinct, or at least no longer cultivated...?). For an even earlier example, picture Egyptian artwork with women in linen gowns that appear to be completely sheer. Our best evidence seems to indicate that the linen really was that fine, and we also know that the airy, floaty "silk gauze" used by Florentine women for their delicate partlets bears little resemblance to modern silk gauze (which is a stiff sort of canvas).
However, if a person were so inclined (as I have been in the past and may someday be again!), one could absolutely do fine counted work on modern garment linen. I'm sure that loads of costumers do this all the time! The key is really just being able to see the holes as you work, and choosing an appropriate grade of linen (not so fine your stitches come out too tiny--as you've noted happening with your muslin). But as we say, we like Happy Beginners, so if you start out with materials that aren't going to fight you, you'll have a much better learning experience!
You can see REALLY EXCELLENT photographs of extant period garments with embroidery in Patterns of Fashion 4 (http://www.amazon.com/Patterns-Fashion-Construction-Accessories-1540-1660/dp/0896762629/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1359760772&sr=1-3&keywords=patterns+of+fashion) (the one with ruffs & undergarments). Which will be either inspiring or intimidating... or possibly both! LOL
Wow! You know a lot! I must have really bad eyes, because I found some pieces of linen (most likely a blend) in my pieces stash and I was trying to see between the weave and I just go crosseyed.
And yea, intimidating is a good word. It's going to be a loooong road...
Thanks again for all your wisdom! Want to black work my stuff? Lol...only kind of kidding. :-\
Sooooo....worked a heart from the posie design... :-[ yeah, it looks like a five year old did it lol.
(http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g321/TheWickedvox/CAM00201_zps01179947.jpg)
I think I know what I did wrong. The right side actually looks better so I think I miscounted on the diagonal on the left side. I'm using the Holbein stitch. I started right in the middle, but the design has two rows, so I had to just pick one and go with it. Do I have to start *right* in the middle? Because I could have included a line down the middle of the heart as part of the whole journey if I had started in a different spot. If that makes sense.
The purple X is the middle--it's my first official cross stitch lol.
Opinions? Critiques?
Huzzah!! You are well on your way!!
A little miscount is easy to frog (needlework term for pulling out stitches, from rip-it, rip-it ;)).
If you find you're having a lot of trouble with the counting, I suppose there's really no reason you couldn't (gasp! Sacrilege!) lightly trace the blackwork design onto the fabric with a pencil, you know, just to learn on... I think I once did that, as a very young needlewoman, with a sharpie and some plastic canvas.... ;) (This thought has honestly never occurred to me before. It's just not the norm, to sketch out a design for counted work!) The nice thing about blackwork is that after doing a couple of the repeats, you won't even need to refer to the chart anymore!
Also, if you feel like your stitches get a little wonky with the Holbein stitch (it's easy to do), try changing your needle out--either for something a little bigger, so it nudges aside the fabric threads a little more, or for a sharp, so you can really get in there and pierce the previous stitches sharply. (FWIW, the project I'm doing now has totally resisted the Holbein stitch; I just cannot for the life of me get the crisp lines I like in my blackwork with it, using this combination of fabric/silk floss. Since the reverse won't be visible, I've decided not to sweat it, and I'm using straight stitch and back stitch.)
My blackworked (Greenwork!) chemise, with strips of embroidery pattern down the front opening and down the sleeves, around the cuff, collar, and ruff edges, was done with the gridded pattern from the Elizabethan Blackwork site.
I used a blue wash-out fabric marker or two, a ruler, and drew grids on my lightweight cotton lawn fabric. The pale blue marker washes out completely, and when you mess up the grid, just a wet q-tip and a little time to dry will fix. Before cutting out the chemise, I spent a winter of evenings stitching a sections, gridding a section, stitching a section. (Could prolly stitch the pattern by memory...) Yes, it took for-freaking-ever, no, it isn't perfect, but Gods! is it ever a cool-looking bit of garb!
I say, use what you want to make yer chemise, experiment with any of the methods you've read about, and do it the way you find best. We look forward to seeing the results!
Thanks Aunty Lou! That is my fall back plan if I just can't get the swing of this. Or just some freehand embroidery and historical accuracy be damned lol! I'm a big fan of whatever works for you. I'd like to see your chemise...that sounds saucy doesn't it? ;)
I know!! I want to see Aunty Lou's greenwork chemise, too!!!
Wicked, I thought you might enjoy this quick look (http://katerina.purplefiles.net/garb/diaries/FL_Turban.html#) at a costumer's first counted embroidery project! :) She was brave and dove in, stitching right on garment linen.
Question: what is "long-arm cross stitch?"
She didn't really expound on her process, but she said she hates counting all those little threads--so she used traditional linen fabric, not embroidery linen, right?
Lastly--this makes my first attempt look positively remedial. And here I thought it was looking decent for a first try. :-[ But I shall press on!
(http://www.fidella.com/webstitch/pics/longarm2.gif)
Instead of the second leg of your cross lining up with the first leg of the next stitch, it goes all the way over an extra set of holes. (I would stitch this from bottom to top, the reverse of how this diagram shows, but it doesn't matter--whatever is comfortable for you. The top legs should all cross the same direction, though.)
Okay, I finished one round.
(http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g321/TheWickedvox/CAM00209_zps5f321148.jpg)
From afar, eh, not bad. But on closer inspection...
(http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g321/TheWickedvox/CAM00211_zpsb8bc634a.jpg)
See that end "leaf" on the right? See how it's not centered over the heart shaped petal? Here's the problem I'm having: I keep having to readjust the pattern because one row gets too close to the other, one stem is too long, the "leaves" are too wide, etc. Sometimes it's a miscount and I pull the stitches (god I've never pulled out so many stitches in my *life*), but other times everything seems right. See how in the bottom row I had to shift the first petal at the point of the hearts *down?* Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. My only thought is I'm not counting my diagonal stitches right. If I'm doing "over two" and I have a diagonal, is it two over *and* up (or down)?? Because that's what I'm doing: over two, up two.
Also, if I have a side that is two stitches over two grids, can I make one long stitch, or is that a no-no?
And if I want to enlarge the pattern, can I just substitute over *four* threads instead of two per stitch?? Or do I make more stitches?! Gaaaaahhh!
Hey, Wicked, how's it going? I had a half a response typed the evening you posted your picture, but things got away from me.
The short version: It's looking great!! Huzzah!!
...I also wanted to mention that I'm working on a project right now that I have miscounted SO MANY TIMES that I ripped out an entire day's work of stitches, and spent the whole evening tonight gridding my fabric (http://cobwebcornerblog.blogspot.com/2008/11/cross-stitch-gridding-tips-by-pam.html)--which I *never* do! (We won't even talk about the miscounts *while* gridding. ::))
I really do believe that this is something anyone can become proficient at--but nobody said it wasn't fussy and time-consuming!
Hey, no worries. I was intensely stitching away and avoiding homework which did me *all* sorts of good on my exam. (focus focus focus)
So, my second cuff turned out *way* better; only a few (less than 105) hiccups remedied by pulling stitches and restarting the journey--story of my life.
(http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g321/TheWickedvox/CAM00219_zps727c0df0.jpg)
I have my first set of blackwork cuffs--huzzah!
Now I want to make the collar but I'm bored to death with that design, plus it's really small and I have to read up on enlarging a pattern (which I can't do because I'm being a good girl and studying really hard for my final ::) ), and I'm not even going to *touch* that griding thing. This would probably be too difficult for me at my budling stage, huh?
(http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g321/TheWickedvox/CAM00220_zpscb871a56.jpg)
But it's sooooo pretty! Like a stained glass window!
Now a new question--do the collars and cuffs need to match in design? Is it period to match? Just good needlework etiquette? I probably should K.I.S.S. until I can really dive in, but you know me--over the top and beyond my abilities is my style! ;)
How about the four petal thingy design (very technical) on this one?
(http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g321/TheWickedvox/CAM00221_zps79e56182.jpg)
I'm going to do the acorns and leaves on my husband's cuffs and collar. Very masculine. ;D
I just found an amazing resource--a collection of antique French, German, and Russian needlework books and pamphlets that have been scanned and re-charted and posted online: http://patternmakercharts.blogspot.com/ (http://patternmakercharts.blogspot.com/)
Literally hundreds of 19th and early 20th century charts. I've spent the afternoon browsing alphabets, looking for something appropriate to my WIP. I think the Russian folk designs are of particular interest to our period, as these designs tend to be much, much older than when published.
Here are a couple of thumbnails:
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_py-4V1Lnp9Y/SpPUPEDNBZI/AAAAAAAAA7E/PAu8fF8CAKQ/s200/p0019.jpg) (http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_py-4V1Lnp9Y/SpPlDbd46lI/AAAAAAAAA88/VRz4O_ZF6mc/s200/p0034.jpg) (http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_py-4V1Lnp9Y/SpNWAibXW_I/AAAAAAAAA6U/8qnG_LV0-qw/s200/p0014.jpg) (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_py-4V1Lnp9Y/SpNTgLqbZBI/AAAAAAAAA50/OeGLMYwEJqA/s200/p0010.jpg)
Some of the French alphabets:
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_py-4V1Lnp9Y/SrbuWecTepI/AAAAAAAABig/CWSs2CBBrHk/s200/Sajou+No+201+-+01.jpg) (http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-0Tww0t0ZfyM/Tqr6_hn3beI/AAAAAAAAFQM/y_MV6I2O89U/s200/Sajou%2BN%25C2%25B0%2B171_Page_04.jpg)
Amazing!
Wow! So beyond my skill level, but wow! They're so pretty. And I love the Russian alphabet one lol. I have a friend who has a love affair with Russia and I'm thinking of making her Russian monograms lol.
I understand griding now. I read up on it (if I don't pass my final my husband is going to be so upset with me), and it makes sense. Kind of. I still have to center the design *in* each grid, right? And I have to grid the pattern to make sure everything is copacetic, right? I wish I understood how to enlarge a pattern. I still haven't found a resource that drives it home for me (you know how thick-headed I am). But the hubby said if I pass my final he'll get me *two* sewing books! I want the embroidery bible and the Tudor Tailor. The Embroidery Bible is all kinds of awesome, and we all know how badly I need the Tudor Tailor. Do you have any other suggestion for a really great instructional embroidery book?
I'm going to be working on a free embroidery spot sampler over the next few weeks to help me learn stitches. Oh! So the two sites I'm using for resources: http://www.embroidery.rocksea.org/stitch/fishbone-stitch/raised-fishbone-stitch/ (http://www.embroidery.rocksea.org/stitch/fishbone-stitch/raised-fishbone-stitch/) and
http://www.needlenthread.com/ (http://www.needlenthread.com/)
The easiest way to enlarge a pattern is to get bigger fabric (a smaller thread count, so go from 32 to 25, or 14 to 11, etc). The next easiest--especially when working with a repeated design, is to just keep stitching more of it!
IMO, the very best stitch instruction diagrams currently being published are by Country Bumpkin. They put out the (uber-expensive) Australian magazine "Inspirations," as well as a number of really beautiful books, which I think are mostly compilations of things from the magazine. I have their book Embroidered Bags and Purses (http://www.amazon.com/Embroidered-Bags-Purses-Sally-Milner/dp/B005EP2TW8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1361585669&sr=8-1&keywords=embroidered+bags+and+purses), and I think it's amazing as far as instruction and inspiration go. Maybe not a lot of projects you're going to jump into tomorrow, but look--$5.00!! Another one of my favorites is this one from Reader's Digest (http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Book-Embroidery-Crewelwork-Embellishments/dp/076210273X/ref=sr_1_5?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1361585940&sr=1-5&keywords=reader%27s+digest+embroidery), and it's only $1.00, so you should TOTALLY order yourself a copy RIGHT THIS MINUTE. And then we can do a couched needlebook stitch-a-long!
I learned a lot from a magazine I subscribed to as a teenager, so my book learnin' recommendations are limited, but some of my favorites are the ginormous "Encyclopedia of Needlework/Embroidery/Fill-in-the-Blank" books I've picked up off the bargain table at CostCo or Half Price Books. There always seem to be some hanging around.
This popped up on the Eliz. Costume facebook page today,
http://openlibrary.org/books/OL25387911M/Il_Burato (http://openlibrary.org/books/OL25387911M/Il_Burato)
Victorian reprint of an embroidery book from 1520's Venice. It has some nice woodcuts showing the process of embroidery. The first 10 pages or so are just blank grids, but after that there are patterns for counted work and designed for belts and various scroll work. ;D
That is *crazy* cool! I wonder if those first pages of grids are examples of fabrics with different thread counts? I wish I knew Italian. Those patterns are so intricate and pretty. Thanks for sharing :)
My favorite part of the book was the woodblock chapter plates, esp. this one:
(http://ia701206.us.archive.org/BookReader/BookReaderImages.php?zip=/8/items/ilburatolibroder00paga/ilburatolibroder00paga_jp2.zip&file=ilburatolibroder00paga_jp2/ilburatolibroder00paga_0060.jp2&scale=4&rotate=0)
Look at those needlewomen! And that 1520s Venetian woman has puff & slash sleeves!
I thought it was about time to resurrect this thread! :) I will have some project updates to post soon, but in the meantime, a Very Excellent Article popped up on Mary Corbet's Needle'n'Thread today, on prepping fabric for surface embroidery. She covers darn near everything, from cutting to pressing to transferring the design.
Preparing Linen, Transferring the Design, and More (http://www.needlenthread.com/2014/01/sg-embroidery-project-ground-fabric-design-transfer-and-more.html)
Her method of pre-shrinking the linen is entirely new to me, although it is definitely something I've been musing about since I've started more embroidery for clothing. I think I need a side-by-side comparison (vs machine washing) with the fabric for my next project.
The one additional thing I do with my linen that she doesn't mention is overcast the edges so they don't fray. I typically do that by hand (just whipstitch over the edge), although a serger is the high tech method!
Quote from: gem on January 22, 2014, 11:11:56 AM
I thought it was about time to resurrect this thread! :) I will have some project updates to post soon, but in the meantime, a Very Excellent Article popped up on Mary Corbet's Needle'n'Thread today, on prepping fabric for surface embroidery. She covers darn near everything, from cutting to pressing to transferring the design.
Preparing Linen, Transferring the Design, and More (http://www.needlenthread.com/2014/01/sg-embroidery-project-ground-fabric-design-transfer-and-more.html)
Her method of pre-shrinking the linen is entirely new to me, although it is definitely something I've been musing about since I've started more embroidery for clothing. I think I need a side-by-side comparison (vs machine washing) with the fabric for my next project.
The one additional thing I do with my linen that she doesn't mention is overcast the edges so they don't fray. I typically do that by hand (just whipstitch over the edge), although a serger is the high tech method!
I LOVE Needle'n'thread! I haven't read that article yet, but my pet faire-only embroidery project is her gold-work Tudor rose. I think she's mentioned before that she serges her edges for some fabrics, and hand-overcasts for others...