Upper hose? Trunks?
I'm not even sure if that's what they're called.
I've only seen a couple of examples of these in a few paintings. (Of course, searching just now proved fruitless...just my luck.)
They basically look like slops but aren't bulky or roomy.
Essentially, they look like biker shorts if they were made out of cotton or leather or something and they seem to fit about as close as tighter jeans might. So, yeah... they look like shorts, only.. with a codpiece. From what I've seen they're paired with (and worn over, obviously) tights.
Can someone tell me: What they're called. What fabric they were most likely made of. Do you know of anyone that offers any for sale? (Though I find that unlikely.)
Thanks again.
Try searching for Breches
Here's a little website I find most helpful when dealing with Medieval Clothing Terms
http://www.personal.utulsa.edu/~marc-carlson/cloth/glossary.html
Peace and Blessings!
The reason I didn't think they would be the same as breeches was that breeches seem to always be rather baggy and roomy. As I said, the ones I've seen were rather tight. Not nearly as tight as...well..tights, but for lack of a better explaination, as I said, fitted as close as form-fitting jeans. Also, most breeches seem to go to the knee or lower. These were above the knee, I'd say by about 4 to 6 inches above.
(I really wish I had saved those pics so I could show exactly what I mean.)
These come close, but not quite.
http://www.twinrosesdesigns.com/Red%20Silk%20Dupioni%20Doublet%20with%20Sleeves.jpg
I think the word you are looking for might be cannions. They are close fitting knee length pants but I'm not sure that they would have been worn on their own. A google search shows them worn under short "pumpkin pants".
(http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:_Zbg2OPK4PcfcM:http://www.wyrdrune.com/Costume/noble/images/TorsoFront.jpg)
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6a/WalterRaleighandson.jpg/160px-WalterRaleighandson.jpg)
Perhaps they weren't worn alone. Or maybe not formally. Or at least not by the upper class.
Thankfully, I recalled at least one of the paintings was The Peasant Dance. The man playing the pipes in the foreground.
http://www.eyeconart.net/history/Renaissance/BrueghelPeasantDance.jpg
Now if I could just recall the other pics/paintings/engravings where I saw these...
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y255/syrilla/Online%20pictures/drawingmen.jpg)
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y255/syrilla/Online%20pictures/mlaterlooks.jpg)
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y255/syrilla/Online%20pictures/mpeasantpants.jpg)
I think the style you are look for is later Renaissance and with the Italian influence.
Venetians maybe? They are knee-length but not really close fitting.
Well, I know one thing for certain, as I mentioned with the above linked painting... These are exactly what I'm talking about and looking for.
(http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k58/machfront1/Pieter_Bruegel_d.jpg)
Still can't remember where I saw the other examples, but no matter. This is what I mean. Never seen anything like this for sale. Guess I'll have to get someone to make some I s'pose...
I would think that showing a seamstress that image would get you what you are looking for and you can call them whatever you want to! LOL (But I do think cannions are what you are looking for. ;)
Well, cannions it is then! ;D
I agree with the suggestion of just having cannions. However, there seems to be a mark along the crotch/upper thigh area that would lead me to think that it could be a very small gathering of fabric. Like a tiny pumpkin puff.
Brueghel painted the peasantry of Flanders (now part of France), so what you're looking at is a very specific regional and economic costume. The pictures (and terms) posted by others apply in other regions and to other classes. I would suggest doing research into men's Flemish costume of the period. There has been a ton of research and recreation of *women's* Flemish costume; hopefully someone will have some information on what the men of the period/region wore, as well.
Good luck!
Quote from: Syrilla on March 24, 2009, 02:43:48 PM
I agree with the suggestion of just having cannions. However, there seems to be a mark along the crotch/upper thigh area that would lead me to think that it could be a very small gathering of fabric. Like a tiny pumpkin puff.
Yeah, I see what you're talking about. Well, that would be cool too. Either way. The cool thing is, it's so basic. Also, if I want, starting with something so basic gives me a good bit of latitude to make it mine with whatever small changes I want to make in the design (like the small puff, there for example),etc. Well, when I say, "changes I want to make" I just mean in the planning stages, since I can't sew.
Quote from: gem on March 24, 2009, 04:39:14 PMwould suggest doing research into men's Flemish costume of the period. There has been a ton of research and recreation of *women's* Flemish costume; hopefully someone will have some information on what the men of the period/region wore, as well.
That's something to think about. Good point.
But then again, the other paintings/drawings/engravings I've seen with the exact same thing weren't by Brueghel (of course, I guess all of them could have been Flemish...it's possible).
Still something to begin looking into.