CRF turning into a Renaissance themed shopping mall?

[Demetrius]

Does anyone remember this from the let's meet at the Scottish/Irish festival in Estes last year?

[Francisco Paula]

I think its utterly crazy that you don't know how to milk a chocolate hamster. My question is why would you want to milk a chocolate hamster into a flask?

[Hey- Arent You?]

I think its utterly crazy that you don't know how to milk a chocolate hamster. My question is why would you want to milk a chocolate hamster into a flask?

because people look at you funny if you walk around suckling a hamster.

[Platt]

Platt is sitting here singing hamster songs....

Harvey, Harvey,
Harvey the Wonder Hamster;
He doesn't bite and he doesn't squeal,
He just runs around on his Hamster Wheel!
Harvey, Harvey,
Harvey......the wonder Hamster..

HEY HARVEY!

("Weird" Al)

[Demetrius]

Ok, I'm a little scared but I want to know......hamsters?

You see- hamsters seem to have a life of their own here... if you go way back in time- oh say a few months or so- and check out some older threads- you shall witness hamster evolution... seriously... you will notice too I had nothing to do with it.
For the real truth you must seek info from Hey Aren't You- for it is with he that the truth of Hamstern shall be reviled... er, revealed...

[Hey- Arent You?]

Ok, I'm a little scared but I want to know......hamsters?

You see- hamsters seem to have a life of their own here... if you go way back in time- oh say a few months or so- and check out some older threads- you shall witness hamster evolution... seriously... you will notice too I had nothing to do with it.
For the real truth you must seek info from Hey Aren't You- for it is with he that the truth of Hamstern shall be reviled... er, revealed...

OH no.  can't pin this on me. (cuz I'm quick like that.)
I only suggested tying hamsters to the jousters lances instead of favors because they were riding elephants.
It was Tanda who wanted to make them little suits......
next thing I knew, YOU were cookin them up, and DeLaney was wolfin 'em down like candy.......

[DeadBishop]

You CO people need to come down from the high altitude every now and then.  That thin air up there is messing with your heads.   


But seriously, if you'd like to keep this discussion going, that's fine, but let's get it back on topic.  Otherwise, I can lock it down if it's served it's purpose since it seems to have run its course.

[DeadBishop]

I've had a request to not lock this thread, but again I insist that this stay on topic.  As fun as the hamster discussion is, it has nothing to do with this thread.

[CapnJack]

The hamster topic is generally thrown in when certain people are afraid there is too much controversy being stirred up by a particular thread.  I appreciate the attempt to lighten the mood, especially since certain people should be VERY careful what they say in public forums such as these.

[Radu the Gypsy]

Jack, this is the sort of thing I'm talking about.  CRF terrifies its employees so thoroughly through their actions that people are afraid to speak their mind.  Hell, Paradise has threatened to ban people before just for membership on a ren fair discussion list (It wasnt, after all, approved by him!).  This will only continue so long as people allow themselves to be threatened into submission.  This is not something new, I've been saying this for over 10 years now.  And guess what, people continue to allow it to happen, so it *does* continue to happen.

[Cynthia_Orella]

*waves* The being scared of losing you job if you open your mouth is a good point. I don't have that feeling here, but I just barely tasted Entertainment employment before things were taken back. Yeah it sucked, yeah it had awful timing. But I'm just hoping its not killing anyones spirit. (yeah cause I felt just freakin' skippy after I got my call) But I'm going to be heartbroken if next year all the people who were... let go... decide not to come back.

[Cobaltblu]

Mr. Paradise sounds like a good name for a professional wrestler.

From what you describe he doesn't sound like the kind of person who should be involved in a renaissance faire.  If I was fired a week before opening (if I worked at faires) I would give all the information to the local news and see if they would be interested in running an expose on what occurred.

I recommend staking out a spot on the road in front of the festival property (not on the property) and holding a large sign describing what happened.

The sign could say "Mr. Paradise fired X people from the faire, one week before opening day.  Don't support the faire."

Those tactics work well for labor unions...here in NY they have a large inflatable rat they put in front of businesses who treat union employees poorly.

Regards,

CB

[Mischief Snicklebritches]

First and foremost...I have no intention of choosing a side  in this arguement. Everyone that has posted here has absolutely valid things to say. They are afterall our opionions and should always be honored by others. Even if the opinions are in disagreement with what others feel. Is that not what one of the liberties gained by that little conflict brought up by Radu?   the freedom of speech?

As it has been said, Neversilent, you are a coward, and I stand behind the challenge for you to publicly apologize and identify yourself. I fully understand your grievence with this whole issue, but you are no better a person for starting horrible rumors on a public forum then the people that this whole nonsence stemmed from in the first place. I also caught that you were a member before posting your OP...and I think I have a pretty good idea who you are in fact. But Im not going to give you the satisfaction...nor the scapegoat of reveling that. So, again...that guntlet has been thrown down and its up to you to grow the cajones and pick it up. If not, I certianly hope, whether we ever find out who you are or not, that you are ashamed of yourself.

Radu- I have ever admired your outright demenor and no BS attidude. I fully back your right to say whatever you wish, as this is a public forum and obviously you have no desire to return to the faire, so say what you will, Huzzah. However, while I agree with you that the only way anyone is going to not be stepped on anymore by the faire, or ANY faire really, is by standing as one united front...you are asking a lot I feel. While the majority of the cast probalby would at this point in the game, I can gaurentee there are about 5 people that would never go against the faire Thus, we are un-united. Those that have it so good they refuese to ruin it, even for the sake of their "family" So, while that is all rebellious and good and what not on paper....fat chance. Plus, there are new suckers turning 18 before every summer here. There will always be a fresh supply of  people that have absolutely no clue what to expect that can be taken advantage of. So inciting a rebellion when not eveyone is on board is tentamount to idiocy.
I too have heard it said that some would rather do without the cast, and really, in truth, we DO take more money than we provide, its just a matter of people needing to see that what we provide will eventually, down the line, turn a profit. No cast= less patrons willing to pay $20 to get into an outdoor shopping mall because you can go to one 10 miles up the highway for free = less money being put in pockets. Unfortunately, I think that some people are the kind that are on a "make the mistake and learn from it" type basis...and cant really see the consequences of  future actions. While one may think that eliminating the cast to eliminate the amount of money being put into it may put that money in thier pockets, will find undoubtedly that that money will need to go toward other things to bolster other parts of the faire (i.e better rides, more stage acts, better and more food ect) to make up for the loss of that entertainment and keep their business open. Lest the entire thing go down the toilet all together. I fully expect within the next few years for the cast to be completely eliminated...and after a season or two of that, we will see a change of heart. Though, I sincerely hope I am wrong.

This is why I say "we can only control ourselves." Because there are going to be people that you, point blank, will not convince to stand up and say "no." So, I am merely encouraging people to weigh their options, make a decision for themselves and see it through. As you have done, some can leave and never look back. Others will want to stay in good graces for when the Faire up-swings and things are good again, and some will ever blindly serve no matter what.

So, with that, I believe Votaire said it perfectly "I may not agree with what you have to say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."

[Jonas_MacPherson]

Agreed. And I will admit, I'm one of these people who, as a small business owner, can see the wisdom behind your words. Things will pick up, however, I think important lessons will be learned, and feelings will be bruised.

As of now, I don't want to burn any bridges, and hopefully when the management sees the value of having a cast, I'll be able to throw my hat in the ring. Until that point, I'll have fun, show up on weekends, and keep trying to have fun.

Radu also has good points. We do need to make a stand at some point, but we need to choose the side carefully. Again, it's about either being diplomatic about this, or burning bridges as we cross them, and potentially watching the fair shut down completely.

So, ultimately, lets hold strong, remain focused on making this fair better in whatever way we, the little people, can. Trust me, this debate alone is offering ideas on how to go about this.

[Capt Gabriela Fullpepper]

Until this state has another faire... it's going to be near impossible to get everyone to avoid this faire. Lets face it, it's a good faire and people have fun and enjoy it. And I am not talking cast or crew, I am talking playtrons, and paytrons alike. IF the faire goes down the tube it will be a sad loss to this state as it is the only good faire we have. And until someone comes up with a million or more $$$ to start a new faire, this one will keep right on going until either the lease runs out and they have to move it, or get tired of it or sell it off to someone else.

Until that time it's the only faire I can make on a regular bases and I will continue to go. I have been coming since the late 80's and I have seen many many changes. Some good some bad and some made no differeance what so ever.

lets face it, this is like many jobs. Many jobs dump on some and bow to others. No job is perfect and if you don't want the job, there are hundreds if not thousands of others that do want your job for even a short time. If you don't like how the faire treats you as a worker, fine, go on strike against it. But you will never get everyone to strike with you. That's just the way people in this country are. It's easier to complain than do something about it.

Stand outside with your sign protesting and I will honk to show I believe in you, but then again do not get angery that I want to enjoy my day at faire cut down cast or not.