The Borgias on Showtime

[Sorcha]

Here is my rather poor take from my TV, I shall attempt again tonight so it does not have the shadows

This is an interesting sleeve fabric! I almost looks like a knit or weave??
Straight across ties in the front.  Hooray.

This is a lot of good information Cilean.  I need to really take some time on your post. Thanks!

[operafantomet]

It is not Venetian by any stretch, but the styles are more reminiscent of Florentine Gowns of the time period.

Here I must protest. The dresses aren't particularly Florentine. Florentines lady of the time wore plain gamurras with wider overdresses overneath, often with splits in the sides. I think the Borgia costumes have a more Venetian flair in that aspect. Venetians wore more elaborate underdresses with more details in front and in the sleeves, and with tighter-fitting overdresses. The use of silks were also more dominant in Venice (which imported in large scale from the Ottoman empire), Lombardy, and Siena and Lucca. Florence had silk industry, but for export. Wools were much in use in the 15th century, especially for the gamurras, with fine silk brocades only used for very special garbs. Browse through Festive Attyre's galleries anew, and I think you'll see more wools than brocades.

That said, the style worn across most italian city states reminded a lot of eachother, it's mostly Florentine style that stands out as a bit different. Florentines had a more pious view of life, and a larger wool trade. The time of the Borgias was also contemporary with the monk Savonarolas rule of Florence ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Girolamo_Savonarola ). Savonarola was in direct opposition to the Borgia pope, naming him as a source of sin. The latter excommunicated him, and eventually it lead to the execution of the monk. Savonarola saw all kinds of earthly vanities as a sin, and had large bonfires where books, art, clothes and jewelry were burned. Of course this affected the fashion of Florence.

If anything, I'd rather point the dresses out as Sienese and/or Roman. Sinea was in Tuscany, but tried hard to separate themselves from the Florentines. They were more influenced with what happened in the Veneto (Venice) and Lazio (Rome) regions than neighbor city state Florence. But again, as Isabella points out, the dresses borrows a bit from each region and from pure costume aesthetic, to get a generic and beautiful late 15th century look. The concept underdress/overdress, for example, seems to have been merged into one layer.


Example of Venetian dresses of the era:



Examples of Florentine dresses of the era:



Examples of Roman and Sienese dresses of the era:

[Syrilla]

Wow, Thank you ladies for all of your input and knowledge on this era!  It is a time period / location that I have very little knowledge about.  And now I do, and it makes me want to make something high waist-ed and flowing!

[Cilean]

My Comment:
It is not Venetian by any stretch, but the styles are more reminiscent of Florentine Gowns of the time period.



[/quote] Here I must protest. The dresses aren't particularly Florentine.[\quote]




I am sorry, it is my thoughts since I have been watching the whole series, so far, I am so sorry my camera's battery is now dead and I am charging it, so I will attempt to get the different photos of the ladies (which I hope we have more, because Lucrezia moves too much to get a good pic of her!) As stated the Florentines to have gamurras and there are some that have this, my thought was that the CD wanted to have a mixture of times but I still think these are more Florentine, You of course can have your own opinion that is what life is about! LOL   


I also have to take pictures of the "Jews" in the "Moor" episodes as they are quite interesting!!  So I hope I can do justice and show some more styles!


Syrilla! I know I fell in love with Florentines 10 years ago because of the use of silks, I love adding pearls and sparklies to my bodices!

Cilean

[operafantomet]

Yeah, I guess it depends on the eye of the viewer. Whatever the case, they finally give the general audience a glimpse of early Renaissance style in mid Italy. Now I'm awaiting the same about the Medici duchy of the 16th century... but I would probably snark the costumes to death, so maybe it's a good idea it hasn't emerged yet...

Anyone wanna bet this series is because of the game "Assassin's Creed 2", set in Renaissance Rome? A friend of mine is totally obsessed with it, and the main quest is apparently to assassin pope Alexander VI Borgia. Funny thing is that he's a true Play Station nerd, and now he wants to know everything about the Borgias and other prominent families of Rome. If he wants that, I can only imagine how many others out there who's wanted the same...

[Genievea Brookstone]

We have to game, and I have to say they do aa amazing job in it from the scenery to the garb to the story line lol.  In fact it was because of the game I started looking into the Italian clothing. Shortly after we got the game,  one of the Borders bookstores in the city was closing and I managed to score a wonderful set of books... The Great Painters of the Italian Renaissance for $40...the books normally go for $150.00.If you can find the set they are well worth it!

Last night the story line finally started to pick up finally in the series.

[operafantomet]

This is not really related to the costumes, but I'm currently in Rome because of an art history course I'm participating, and yesterday we visited the Borgia apartment in the Vatican. The apartments belonged to pope Alexander VI Borgia and his family. In other words the ones depicted in "The Borgias". The apartment consists of 6 rooms of various sizes, and they're all impressively decorated, between 1492-95.

One of the rooms are newly restored, one is under restoration. The newly restored one looked fantastic, and they had also revealed so far unknown decorations on the walls.

Without describing every room and every detail, here's some pictures from the various rooms in the apartment:


Picture from the newly restored room. It had a comfortable fire place, and the walls were decorated with illusionistic draperies, as well as shelves and items. Over the fire place is the coat of arms of the family; a red bull to the left, and yellow and black stripes to the right.




The floors were so impressively decorated, with glazed tiles. They had intricate patterns, both in the pattern on each tile, and in how they were put on the floor. This went for all the rooms. So cool.




From what I understood, these were newly discovered on the wall: the golden pattern of the draperies, as well as the shelves with items on display. One shelf had the papal tiara studded with pearls, another had exclusive plates, cups (like real-life displays used during festivities). The golden pattern is often referred to as "Vinci knots". Leonardo da Vinci was very fond of this kind of intricate pattern as well, but he did not invent it as some people believe.



The roof decorations and fresco on the short walls in the "Lives of the Saints" cycle. The larger wall has the "Saint Catherine of Alexandra disputing with the emperor", in which one thinks Lucrezia de' Borgia is depicted in. That one is to the right. To the left is restoration work in progress.

[gem]

Wow, Anea--that's incredible! Thank you so much for sharing those photos. It's amazing to see the mix of ancient/traditional Italian decoration (elaborately painted wall scenes, etc) with very "modern" Renaissance features (fireplaces). Beautiful!

[Syrilla]

Jaw dropping beautiful and very jealous of your location!

[operafantomet]

Glad you enjoyed it! My internet access is sporadic, so there's a lot more I've wanted to share which must wait a while yet. But the apartments really is fantastic. Alas since some of the walls are bare today (they probably had real drapes/carpets originally) they use the rooms for displaying modern art. I wasn't a fan of that. I can only imagine how it looked originally, with decorated floors, drapes, frescoes and decorated roofs, along with few but exquisite pieces of furniture. And people in glittering clothes and jewels!

Ironically I'm writing about the apartment above the Borgia one. Pope Julius II della Rovere finished the structure and got it decorated by Raphael. Mostly because he despised his predecessor, the Borgia pope, and didn't want his opulent (and at this time old fashioned) apartment as his home. The apartment of the Rovere pope is today knows as "Raphael's rooms" or "Raphael's stanza". VERY different from the Borgia one.

( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raphael_Rooms )

[operafantomet]

Dress galore!



Both of these are from the same room of the Borgia apartment in the Vatican, from the "Lives of the Saints" cycle. The first shows three young women representing temptation in the desert (note their demon feet, wings and golden horns). I love the dress of the one to the left.

The second shows saint Catherine of Alexandria disputing with the emperor. It's thought that Lucrezia de' Borgia was used as a model for this figure. For whatever it's worth, the saint is dressed in a fashionable and contemporary dress, and the long, blonde hair corresponds with descriptions of the named Lucrezia. But there's no known portraits of Lucrezia to compare with, and no written sources on the subject either, so it's only an interpretation. It was not uncommon to put prominent family members into such large mural frescoes, though. Again, I love the dress. Look at that hem! I also love the "Vinci knots" in the patterned blue dress fabric. A paler, but straighter version can be seen here:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/Lucretia_Borgia_Pinturicchio.jpg

Both are photographed from underneath, so their faces in particular are a bit off. But the colours are rather faithful to how they appeared on site, and as you can see they are much bolder in colour than most online reproductions.

One interesting thing to notice is that most of the gold decorations are put on top of a layer of wax. The wax is used to create a raised field where the gold is applied - especially for buildings, but also for stuff like the saint's halo, the V neckline, and the horns of the temptresses. This gave a cool effect which is often missed online.

[operafantomet]

Watching the first episodes of "The Borgias" now. Great drama, mixed on the costumes, and already loving Jeremy Irons. Looking forward to digging deeper into it.

However... I know it's petty of me, but I thought the use of art in the intro was kinda... fail. They should have stuck to period appropriate Italian art. Mixing in Caravaggio (Baroque) and Cranach (German) seemed very unnecessary. I know the general audience couldn't care less, but it would have been no problem for them to find similar motifs from Italian Renaissance art.

I'm sure the mixture of art sets the mood well. But it makes as much sense to me as watching an intro of Titanic with art from the 1910s and the 1970s. You should have a good and/or artistic reason for doing it. In "The Borgias" it felt more like laziness.