Cartridge pleated sleeves?

[gem]

That's a thing, right?

I'm making Milord the robe from Simplicity 5840, and the sleeve cap is very gathered (thoughtfully omitted from the line drawing  ). I'm using a heavy home dec velvet/chenille, and I was thinking cartridge pleats would be a snazzier (and probably nicer) finish than just a basic gather.

Not entirely sure how to go about it, though. I know how to make cartridge pleats.  I'm just not sure how to apply that technique to a sleeve.

Advice? Tutorials?

Thanks!

[isabelladangelo]

Because you are using a chenille, I'd cut the sleeve cap to get rid of the gathers altogether. 

[Lady Kathleen of Olmsted]

In the BBC series THE SIX WIVES OF HENRY VII and ELIZABETH R, there are many scenes showing Cartridge pleated sleeves of  Bishops Thomas Cranmer and Stephen Gardiner, some of the great over coats of the King and Ministers, etc. Same with ELIZABETH R.

The Bishops of Henry VII's time and the pleating of their attire.

Stephen Gardiner


Thomas Cranmer

Cartridge pleating sleeves was done in the 17th century as well.


I like the idea of Cartridge pleated sleeves using Chenille. Go for it gem.

[Lady Kathleen of Olmsted]

Here is an Elizabethan  Spanish surcoat done by Lynn McMasters years ago showing Cartridge Pleated sleeves. Classy.

[gem]

Thanks, Lady K! That heavy elegance and "scholarliness" is exactly what I'm after, and why I thought this would be a good alternative to traditional gathering.

The question is... how do I *do* it? The whole sleeve isn't pleated; how do you combine the finished edges needed for attaching cartridge pleats, with the rest of the raw edge of the sleeve? Or would you narrowly hem the whole sleeve head/cap, and hand-sew the whole sleeve in place? Or would you finish none of it, and proceed as if those cartridge pleats were ordinary gathers?

How would you go about it?

Gramercy!

[Lady Kathleen of Olmsted]

Depending how full the sleeve cap is, you would have an area in which to pleat as you would a skirt.  I would first use a wide bias tape to finish off the Sleeve Cap before making rout marks Making your marks closer together.

I would also bind the inside of the Armsythe as well so that when you attach the sleeve, you get a clean overall finish. Be sure to sew your side seams first, then bind both the Armsythe and sleeve.

Here are a few Blog spots.

http://americanduchess.blogspot.com/2010_04_01_archive.html
American Duchess is a good source for things and information.

http://historicalsewing.com/

http://www.renaissancetailor.com/

Hope this helps, gem

[Irma]

Ummm - I did small cartridge pleats on the sleeve caps of my most recent gown.  I used a very narrow drapery shirring tape.  But instead of properly whip stitching as on a bodice to a skirt, I stitched them into the bodice as on a conventional sleeve, then mashed them between the bodice and the lining.  I wasn't sure how to whip stitch the top part of the sleeve and then deal with the underarm area.  It's sort of bunchy on the inside, but looks right from the outside.  I don't have any good photos of that, but you might get the idea from this one.

The shirring tape was only about an inch or so wide, and had two drawing strings.

[Kate XXXXXX]

Cartridge pleated sleeves:

[gem]

Well, pox! I got all excited about doing this, and even bought some narrower shirring tape... and then I actually sewed the sleeve into the mockup. It turns out that there's not nearly as much ease as I thought--as in, practically none, in all that vast enormous sleeve. Alas! If I had more time, I might re-draft the sleeve to allow for the pleating, but I need this done by the end of this week, and I have three other projects (and a job) to work on, too.

Ah, well--it's definitely going on the to-do list, whenever I do tackle noble garb for Milord. (When he stops requesting fantasy pieces.) Irma, those are so beautiful! I've used header tape in a skirt, but what I had on hand was a little wide for a sleeve head (3"). I found some 1.5" lightweight stuff at Hobby Lobby.

Kate--ha! I *knew* I'd seen those sleeves before! How did you do them? More details, please!

[Butch]

Could you just pleat the top-front portion of the sleeve and then make it smooth on the rest of the joint?  Maybe match the bottom of the sleeve with the bottom of the armsythe?  Or, if the outer portion of the sleeve is already decorated, balance the pleats on the top-front to match the top-rear?  And maybe, instead of cartridge pleats, did you look at small box pleats?

[Irma]

I am hatching another project, and want to cartridge pleat the sleeves.  The fabric is this green, sort of silky something, fabric content unknown.  It has small, raised areas spaced 1/2 inch apart

and could probably use those as a guide for the stitches.  Attaching the cartridge pleated skirt to the bodice of my last gown was successful.  I understand the concept of clean finishing the edges of the sleeves and the armscye before they are sewn together.  I am having trouble with the mental picture of what the seam where the sleeves and bodice will look like when done.  Do I whip stitch right sides together; are the little tubes of the pleats supposed to appear on the inside of the armscye the way they do on the skirt?  Can there be little bands of fabric set back a little from and around the edge of the armscye, wide enough so that after the sleeves are stitched to the opening, the bands fold down towards the sleeve and hide the seam?

[gem]

Irma, I can't answer any of your questions, but I wanted to say... I think I have both those fabrics! Did they come from JoAnn? I have the viney green, and the dot in red (which is for this, waiting for me to finish the embroidery for the smock). IIRC, the fabric is mostly cotton (if it is the same as my red dots).

I am totally captivated by your color scheme there and can't wait to see what it's going to be!

[Irma]

GEM:  The viney green is definitely from Joann.  The dotted one I assume is from Joann - it's been a long time since I got it.  My options for fabric stores are very limited.  Although I had a great stroke of luck with fabric-store.com with some linen almost the exact green of the dotted fabric.  Please share your progress on the red.  I'm sure it will be beautiful.

[Enolate]

GEM:  The viney green is definitely from Joann.  The dotted one I assume is from Joann - it's been a long time since I got it.  My options for fabric stores are very limited.  Although I had a great stroke of luck with fabric-store.com with some linen almost the exact green of the dotted fabric.  Please share your progress on the red.  I'm sure it will be beautiful.

I started a learn to sew project last weekend with same green vine fabric-purchased at my Joann. My attempt is to make a cloak with it as outer material and a lighter green satin lining. I was looking for some sort of brocade and this fabric jumped out at me. My plan is to post when done to tell the world I am learning a new skill. It does feel a little silly, though, when I see so many wonderful and awe inspiring posts to this forum section.

[Rowan MacD]

  Yep, the vine-y green is the same fabric I made my last noble gown from. I got it on sale from Joann's at $7.00 yd.   It comes in red and gold too and is surprisingly light weight for being dec fabric.
  The soft satin looks like the same stuff I bought to make over sleeves from. Is it a yellow green?
    I abandoned that project when I realized how freaking slippery that stuff is  even though it's deliciously soft. ^_^.  It's also thicker than wedding satin.
    I found 1.5 yds of it in the remnants bin so I wasn't out that much money, and it made some pretty neck coolers.
  Edit: I took a look-Mine is plain satin, no dots. 

[Trillium]

Enolate, we would love to see your cloak!  We all had to start somewhere!  Congratulations on a new skill and hobby.  It will soon take over all your spare time!

[Irma]

Enolate, we would love to see your cloak!  We all had to start somewhere!  Congratulations on a new skill and hobby.  It will soon take over all your spare time!

That's right.  One small stitch leads to another.  I even plan and sew projects in my sleep!

[gem]

Irma, I see you haven't gotten any replies yet on the Facebook group... I am hunting a photo I've pinned somewhere of in-progress CP sleeves, but no luck so far.

Maybe look again at Kate's picture (the silver) on the previous page. I can't tell for sure, but it almost looks like she simply abuts the sleeve to the sleeve cap edge, and you see the top edge of the pleats. Another photo of Kate-done CP sleeves is on this page of her website (photo #16, of the back of the black dress): http://www.jollydicey.co.uk/Jolly%20Dicey%20Costume/17th%20Century%20-%20King%27s%20Musketeers

And it really does look like they're just sitting there.

...And in this lengthy CP tutorial from Historical Sewing, she says

If your pleats are very wide on the inside, you can fold them to one side (check from the garment's right side to see which way you want them to lie) and tack down on top of each other on the inside. This will make them look more like flat knife pleats.

And there's a picture of what that looks like:



That seems like a wholly logical solution--you get the fullness and "classiness" of cartridge pleats, but without the thick ridge on the wrong side.

[Irma]

Thanks, GEM!  Those are some very helpful suggestions.  I'll have to do a couple of test sleeves to see what I like best.  That black gown is gorgeous!

[Enolate]

Enolate, we would love to see your cloak!  We all had to start somewhere!  Congratulations on a new skill and hobby.  It will soon take over all your spare time!

That's right.  One small stitch leads to another.  I even plan and sew projects in my sleep!

Not sure if I should post here or finished projects, but the green viney cloak is finished.



I used Burda 7333, but I added a liner. While I did all the work myself, my wife explained to me how to sew the liner and blind stitch in the ditch. The following are the "warts and all" of the mistakes I made.









All in all, I do feel pretty good about it, even though there are these imperfections. My goal was to learn and not get discouraged. I can at least state that I can't wait to start the next project.

Thanks for the encouragement!

[isabelladangelo]

It looks great for a first project!  Technically, it probably should go in the Gallery of Finished Projects thread.   But you can just double post it if you want. 

Also, trim hides many mistakes.  :-)

[Rowan MacD]

^^ditto the trim comment^^. Uneven hems, offset seams (it happens) fraying edges and 'unexpected gathers'  as well as any necessary top stitching that you may not want seen.
 
  When I make hats the hatbands also serve to cover any visible stitches where the crown is joined to the brim.  Hand stitching on Bias strips around the brim edge can be covered with lace or gimp.

[Ser Niall]

Not sure if I should post here or finished projects, but the green viney cloak is finished.



I used Burda 7333, but I added a liner. While I did all the work myself, my wife explained to me how to sew the liner and blind stitch in the ditch. The following are the "warts and all" of the mistakes I made.

First, cloak looks really nice.  Congrats on your successful project!

It leads me to a question though.  My seams tend to look like this too after adding the lining from "stitching in the ditch."  Experts, is there a way to avoid this?  Is this just something you have to get a feel for, or *gasp* hand stitch it?

[isabelladangelo]

You can pin it to make sure it's even before you sew - this helps a lot but it takes time.  Or you can hand sew - I just whip stitch the seams.  It takes about 15 minutes for the average neckline; 30 min for an average waistline. 

[Enolate]

My wife had suggested that I could either hand stitch or use the machine- but then I recall her saying life is to short to hand sew. So I can conclude that one can do it fast or do it fastidious but not both.