Was Elizabeth I a Virgin Queen in name only?

[Welsh Wench]

Well, there are virgins and then there are VIRGINS.

No one knows if Elizabeth I was a virgin or not.

But she refused to share the throne and be dominated by a man.
You have to respect that. Plus she would not lose her life in childbirth nor would there be any opposition to the throne.
It wouldn't be the first time a child would try to usurp its parent's throne.

Perhaps she was basing this on Henry II who had a tapestry of four eaglets preying on a parent bird. The fourth was poised to gouge its parent's eyes out. Henry had said, 'The four eaglets are my four sons who cease not to persecute me even unto death'.
The fourth was King John of Magna Carta fame, who joined his older brother Richard the Lionhearted in his final rebellion against Henry.

Richard did have good reason, since it was rumoured Henry had slept with his fiancee.

But I digress....the question is this--

Was Elizabeth really the Virgin Queen or was this a bit of hypocrisy on her part given the attentions of Robert Dudly, Sir Walter Raleigh, and Robert Devereux?

Open for discussion, anyone?

[Master James]

Well when they were negotiating the marriage treaty with Alecon, she was supposedly examined by French doctors who pronounced her a virgin in all respects.  Now were they correct, forced into that statement or simply not knowing what the heck they were looking at is unknown but she was officially declared a virgin at that point anyway as a result.

[BLAKDUKE]

since it was well known that she had at least 2 lovers, the Earls of Leicester and Dudley, even she must have had itches to be scratched now and then, but birth control being what it was and the knowledge of that being what it was, I think it is a case of flip a coin, yea or nay.....................

[Richard de Graeme]

Her "virginity" was probably symbolic...married to England and all.

[Welsh Wench]

since it was well known that she had at least 2 lovers, the Earls of Leicester and Dudley, even she must have had itches to be scratched now and then, but birth control being what it was and the knowledge of that being what it was, I think it is a case of flip a coin, yea or nay.....................

Maybe they were just making out?

But then there was the whole Amy Robsart thing.....

[Master James]

Robert Dudley and the Earl of Leicester were the same person.  Elizabeth raised him to Earl of Leicester around 1570 or so if I remember right.  However there are rumors of her with Sir Walter Raleigh and Robert Devereaux after Dudley's death as well.  It seems that she trully was in love with Dudley but would never marry him since the last letter he wrote her, she in her own hand wrote, "His last letter" and kept it until her death.  It is also reputed that as she was dying she uttered his name.

[Welsh Wench]

And Robert Devereux was the Earl of Leicester's stepson.

His great-grandmother was Mary Boleyn.

Um..is all this legal?

[BLAKDUKE]

Robert Dudley and the Earl of Leicester were the same person.  Elizabeth raised him to Earl of Leicester around 1570 or so if I remember right.  However there are rumors of her with Sir Walter Raleigh and Robert Devereaux after Dudley's death as well.  It seems that she trully was in love with Dudley but would never marry him since the last letter he wrote her, she in her own hand wrote, "His last letter" and kept it until her death.  It is also reputed that as she was dying she uttered his name.

Your right.  I was confused and meant to say Robert Deveraux Earl of Essex.  Brain freeze is happening at warmer and warmer temperatures these days.

[Master James]

Robert Dudley and the Earl of Leicester were the same person.  Elizabeth raised him to Earl of Leicester around 1570 or so if I remember right.  However there are rumors of her with Sir Walter Raleigh and Robert Devereaux after Dudley's death as well.  It seems that she trully was in love with Dudley but would never marry him since the last letter he wrote her, she in her own hand wrote, "His last letter" and kept it until her death.  It is also reputed that as she was dying she uttered his name.

Your right.  I was confused and meant to say Robert Deveraux Earl of Essex.  Brain freeze is happening at warmer and warmer temperatures these days.

LOL I KNOW what you mean!

And Robert Devereux was the Earl of Leicester's stepson.

His great-grandmother was Mary Boleyn.

Um..is all this legal?

Yeah really!  Why do you think they called everyone cousin?  Its because they were!

[BLAKDUKE]

Well as thy used to say in those days

"incest is best"

That way we keep it all in the family.

[Welsh Wench]

At least Elizabeth didn't have to ask, 'Who's your daddy?' 

[LadyDracolich]

Robert Dudley was her 'Master of the Horse' before she made him an Earl... And a terrible tactician in the field.  But, I digress....  There are A LOT of things you can do in the bedroom without actually breaching the 'maiden head'.  My guess, she did lots of that.  I think she was really a virgin.  And, I believe that part of the reason she never married was because of her father.  How many times was he divorced or annulled?  AND he had  her mother beheaded, regardless of the charges against her, he could have saved face and got what he wanted without killing her.  Katherine wouldn't allow him to divorce her and he sent her away and had the marriage annulled.  He could have done something similar to Anne.  But, my point is that Elizabeth didn't trust the institution of marriage, and with good reason.  She's still my favorite queen.

[BLAKDUKE]

Robert Dudley was her 'Master of the Horse' before she made him an Earl... And a terrible tactician in the field.  But, I digress....  There are A LOT of things you can do in the bedroom without actually breaching the 'maiden head'.  My guess, she did lots of that.  I think she was really a virgin.  And, I believe that part of the reason she never married was because of her father.  How many times was he divorced or annulled?  AND he had  her mother beheaded, regardless of the charges against her, he could have saved face and got what he wanted without killing her.  Katherine wouldn't allow him to divorce her and he sent her away and had the marriage annulled.  He could have done something similar to Anne.  But, my point is that Elizabeth didn't trust the institution of marriage, and with good reason.  She's still my favorite queen.

Very good points all, however like most of the mysteries of those times, unless we find a hidden authenic diary, we will never know for sure.
However the discussion is interesting.

[KeeperoftheBar]

Elizabeth was a very good queen but she failed in one of her most important duties to England which was to provide a successor. 
Even Prince Charles has made "an heir and a spare".

[LadyDracolich]

Elizabeth was a very good queen but she failed in one of her most important duties to England which was to provide a successor. 
Even Prince Charles has made "an heir and a spare".

Actually, she did better than providing just a successor.  When she ascended the throne, the country was practically bankrupt.  Between previous wars and her father's issues with Rome (which I'm sure cost a small fortune in the end), the country barely had some where in the area of 200,000 pounds.  Granted, that was a great deal of money, but not as much as you'd think.  She pulled the country out of that little financial crises, made the British Navy one of the greatest in the world and pretty much put Spain in it's place.  I'm sorry, but I'd say that's a damn good legacy.  Heir or no.  Furthermore, she made it ok for women to rule countries in their own right without depending on the strength of a man to solidify her authority and right to rule.  Following her were Queen Christina of Sweden and Queen Victoria, Queen Elizabeth II.. And Catherine the Great (who was married and my history knowledge regarding her is a bit fuzzy). 

So, still one of the greatest monarchs EVER,  heir or no.  She did more than provide England with an heir, she provided them with the strength of an autonomous nation that became one of the greatest powers in Europe.