Following Orders

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

An hour to waste...and all you had to read was my post.......wow.....you were doomed!

Thanks, I try to touch all the aspects of the Order, and the others...

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

New book alert: I purchased Thomas Asbridge's The Crusades; The Authoritative History of the War for the Holy Land.

I look forward to reading it, as I have read his book on the First Crusade.

Now back to my efforts of shedding light on obscure history, and giving myself something to dwell upon.

We all know that the Templars, and the militant aspect of the Hospitallers started after the success of the First Crusade. During the Second Crusade, the Templars made a name for themselves when they assumed leadership(appointed by Louis VII-They provided a Templar Brother as the leader of each small unit that the army was broken down into) of a besieged army, on the way overland to the Holy Land. It was their (Templars) discipline and tactics that helped save King Louis VII's army from disintegration and total destruction.

It was during this epic operation that a story developed around the Templars during the siege of Ascalon (also the subject of the photo on the cover of my latest book purchase). It was said by "historians" of the age; that during this siege, when a breach was made in the city's walls, that the Master of the Temple (Tremblay) and his fellow Warrior Monks, held the Christian army at bay, so that they could go in and capture the city, thus giving them the rights to the spoils of war. The story then tells of how because of the Master's greed that they got lost, were surrounded and subsequently killed by the enemy.

It is remarkable that the description of the city is left out. Ascalon was known to have over 50 towers on walls that stretched for miles. This being the case, if the Templars had created a breach, many of the besieging Christian host, might have been unaware of the event. The Templars being the astute masters of the battlefield, would have immediately rushed in, to exploit the breach, thus preventing "having to pay for the same ground twice", by waiting for reinforcements, whilst the enemy reinforced the new point of weakness.

All these "contemporary" histories were written years after the fact. Two sources from the time period of the event note, that the Templars exploited their immediate success, capitalizing on the shock and surprise of their breach, and rushed to the center of the city, where they were forced to make a "final stand" as no fellow Christians came to their aid. They were slaughtered, and their body's hung from the walls of the city by the enemy.

Since no fellow Christians came to their aid, whether it be because they didn't know of the breach, or willing abandoned these stoic heroes, seems to give credibility to the idea that these later writers wrote history to protect their ancestors' reputations.

Things that make you go "hhhhhmmmmmmm..........."

Please see Helen Nicholson's newest book: A Brief History of the Knights Templar

[Just Jesse]

im so pissed that i couldnt go to ga saterday. ive planned for a year but my girlfriend was too f!@#$% up to answer or tell me to go without her, but of course i wasn't going to drive 3 hours alone...and not share the event...but im sorry i didn't get to meet up...

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

im so pissed that i couldnt go to ga saterday. ive planned for a year but my girlfriend was too f!@#$% up to answer or tell me to go without her, but of course i wasn't going to drive 3 hours alone...and not share the event...but im sorry i didn't get to meet up...

PJ (Pirate Jesse),

It is a sad tale you spin, for it was a good time on both days of opening weekend. A bit of advice though, you may want to temper that written anger against your better half, for fear of offending those of the fairer sex that visit and review this thread.

Pax vobiscum.

[SirMichael]

Greetings Brothers and Warrior Monk,

I saw a message from Warrior Monk earlier today about what books are we reading, I don't see that message here but I do have my list:

1. The Crusades by Thomas Asbridge - a history of the war for the holy lands

2. Knight - Nobel Warrior of England - Christopher Gravett - knights from 1200-1600

3. Bretheren by Robyn Young - a novel about the Knights Templar

4. The Last Templar by Reymond Khoury a novel on the Templar's

5. Holy Warriors by JonathanPhillips - a history on the crusades

6. Legionary by Philip Matyszak - a roman soldiers manual on tactics

7. The Time Traveler's Guide to Medieval England by Ian Mortimer a visitors guide to 14th century England

8. The Templers by Barbara Frale - the secret history of Templars revealed

9. Knights by Constance Brittain Bouchard - a history of the legendary Knights

10. Crusades and Crusader Knights by Charles Phillips - an illustrated history of the Crusades

11. Knights of Jerusalem by David Nicolle - a history of the hospitallers


I do buy alot from the Military Book Club...they seem to have some good offerings.

I bid all thee a Good Night....


Sir Michael

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

Sir Michael,

Thanks for your post. I see several fictional series in there. I just finished Robyn Young's Brethren trilogy, and I have two of Jack Whyte's Templar trilogy as well.

As for my reference libray here at the castle, I list the following in my possession (And I agree with your Military Book Club assessment. I also use History Book Club)

1.   God's War, A New History of the Crusades; Christopher Tyerman

2.   The Last Templar, The Tragedy of Jacques de Molay: Alain Demurger

3.   The Knights Templar, A New History: Helen Nicholson

4.   Richard the Lionheart; The Mighty Crusader: D. Miller

5.   The Knights Templar in the Golden Age of Spain; Atienza

6.   The Illustrated History of the Knights Templar; Wasserman

7.   The Crusades: M. Paine

8.   God Wills It: Bartlett

9.   Crusades: T. Madden

10.   Knights: J. Heller

11.   Armour and Weapons: Charles Ffoulkes

12.   The Chronicle History of Knights: A Hopkins

13.   God's Warriors: H. Nicholson

14.   Acre 1291:Osprey Publishing

15.   The 3rd Crusade: Osprey Publishing

16.   Knights Templar: Osprey Publishing

17.   Knights Hospitaller: Osprey Publishing

18.   The 12th Century English Knight: Osprey Publishing

19.   Teutonic Knights: Urban

20.   The Dream And The Tomb: Payne

21.   Knights Templar: S. Howarth

22.   Knights Templar-God's Warriors, The Devil's Bankers: Sarello

23.   The Templars: P. Read

24.   Templars and Assassins: Wassermann

25.   The Templars: E. Burman

26.   Warriors of God: J. Reaston

27.   Northern Crusades: Christensan

28.   The Monks of War: D. Seward

29.   The Knight: Barber

30.   Fighting For Christendom: Tyerman

31.   Dungeon, Fire, and Sword, The Knights Templar in the Crusades: Robinson

32.   Albigensian Crusade: Sumption

33.   The Way of The Crusades: Williams

34.   The Knights Templar: S. Martin

35.   Soldiers of The Faith: Finucane

36.   Warfare In The Middle Ages: R. Humble

37.   Medieval Warfare: Koch

38.   Historical Atlas of The Crusades: A. Konstam

39.   The Rise and Fall of The Knights Templar: G. Napier

40.   Armies of the Crusades: Osprey Publishing

41.   Cathar Castles 1209-1300: Osprey Publishing

42.   Knights Templar Encyclopedia: The Essential Guide to the People, Places, Events, and Symbols of the Order of the Temple: K.Ralls

43.   The Rule of the Templars: J.M.Upton-Ward

44.   The Piebald Standard : Edith Simon

45.   The New Concise History of the Crusades: Thomas F. Madden

46.   The Real History of the Templars : Sharan Newman

47.   The Templars, A complete introduction to the Legendary Monk Warriors: Miguel Gomez

48.   The Knights Templar, Discovering the myth and reality of a legendary Brotherhood: Susie Hodge

49.   The Medieval Soldier : Vesey Norman

50.   Fighting for the Faith : D. Niccole

51.   El Cid; The Making of a Legend : M. J. Trow

52.   Warriors of the Lord: The Military Orders of Christendom : Michael J. Walsh

53.   Battles of the Crusades 1097-1444; from Dorylaeum to Varna : Devries, Dickie, Dougherty, Jestice, Jorgensen, and Pavkovic

54.   The Templars, Holy Warrior Monks of the Ancient Lands : Jack M. Driver

55.   Templar Organization, The Management of Warrior Monasticism : S.T. Bruno

56.   A Most Holy War, The Albigensian Crusade and the Battle for Christiandom: Mark Gregory Pegg  

57.   A to Z of the Knights Templar, A Guide to their History and Legacy: Gordon Napier

58.    Essential Histories; The Crusades : David Nicolle

59.   Battles of the Medieval World 1000-1500, From Hastings to Constantinople: Devries, Dickie, Dougherty, Jestice, Jorgensen, and Pavkovic

60.   Templar Knights and the Crusades; Charles R. Dillon

61.   The Enigma of the Knights Templar: Marilyn Hopkins

62.   The New Knighthood, A History of the Order of the Temple: M. Barber

63.   Knights of Jerusalem, The Crusading Order of Hospitallers 1100-1565: David Nicholle

64.   Crusader Castles in the Holy Land; David Nicholle

65.   Nobly Born, An illustrated History of the Knights Templar; Stephen Dafoe

66.   Templars, Hospitallers, and Teutonic Knights, Images of the Military Orders 1128-1291; Helen Nicholson

67.   Chronicles of the Crusades; Villehardouin & Joinville

68.   The Templars, The secret history revealed; Barbara Frale

69.   The Crusades in the Holy Land; Meron Benvenisti

70.   Teutonic Knight 1190-1561; Osprey Publishing

71.   The Crusades; Osprey Publishing Elite #19

72.   The Scandanavian/Baltic Crusades 1100-1500; Osprey Publishing

73.   Knight of Outremer AD 1187-1344; Osprey Publishing

74.   The Crusades- Essential Histories; Osprey Publishing

75.   The Illustrated history of the Crusades and the Crusader Knights ; C. Phillips

76.   Richard the Lionheart ; J. Gillingham

77.   Crusades ; Terry Jones & Alan Ereira

78.   The Siege of Jerusalem, Crusade and Conquest in 1099; Conor Kostick

79.   The Templars, The History & The Myth; Michael Haag

80.   The Crusades, History and Myths Revealed; Michael Paine

81.   Leper Knights: Order of St Lazarus of Jerusalem in England, c.1150-1544;  D. Marcombe

82.   The Templars, Knights of Christ; Regine Pernoud

83.   God's Battalions, The Case for the Crusades; Rodney Stark

84.   Knights in History and Legend; Constance Bouchard

85.   The Crusades- A Brief Insight; Christopher Tyerman

86.   A Brief History of the Knights Templar; Helen Nicholson

87.   Holy Warriors, A Modern History of the Crusades; Jonathan Phillips

88.   Armies and Enemies of the Crusades 1096-1291 (PDF); Ian Heath

89.   The Crusades- A History of the War for the Holy Land; Thomas Asbridge

[Sir Samuel]

Gentlemen,
I do love copy and paste. This is like the Knights best seller list  Thank You  My fellows

[Just Jesse]

well she knew how much this ment to me, but yet again i get weed picked over me... this has been one shiner bock-weed puller of a year. im faithless, and just mad...

[Just Jesse]

ugh i cant even vent , shat- iss of a year...

[Lord Clisto of York]

Sir Michael,

Thanks for your post. I see several fictional series in there. I just finished Robyn Young's Brethren trilogy, and I have two of Jack Whyte's Templar trilogy as well.

As for my reference libray here at the castle, I list the following in my possession (And I agree with your Military Book Club assessment. I also use History Book Club)

1.   God's War, A New History of the Crusades; Christopher Tyerman

2.   The Last Templar, The Tragedy of Jacques de Molay: Alain Demurger

3.   The Knights Templar, A New History: Helen Nicholson

4.   Richard the Lionheart; The Mighty Crusader: D. Miller

5.   The Knights Templar in the Golden Age of Spain; Atienza

6.   The Illustrated History of the Knights Templar; Wasserman

7.   The Crusades: M. Paine

8.   God Wills It: Bartlett

9.   Crusades: T. Madden

10.   Knights: J. Heller

11.   Armour and Weapons: Charles Ffoulkes

12.   The Chronicle History of Knights: A Hopkins

13.   God's Warriors: H. Nicholson

14.   Acre 1291:Osprey Publishing

15.   The 3rd Crusade: Osprey Publishing

16.   Knights Templar: Osprey Publishing

17.   Knights Hospitaller: Osprey Publishing

18.   The 12th Century English Knight: Osprey Publishing

19.   Teutonic Knights: Urban

20.   The Dream And The Tomb: Payne

21.   Knights Templar: S. Howarth

22.   Knights Templar-God's Warriors, The Devil's Bankers: Sarello

23.   The Templars: P. Read

24.   Templars and Assassins: Wassermann

25.   The Templars: E. Burman

26.   Warriors of God: J. Reaston

27.   Northern Crusades: Christensan

28.   The Monks of War: D. Seward

29.   The Knight: Barber

30.   Fighting For Christendom: Tyerman

31.   Dungeon, Fire, and Sword, The Knights Templar in the Crusades: Robinson

32.   Albigensian Crusade: Sumption

33.   The Way of The Crusades: Williams

34.   The Knights Templar: S. Martin

35.   Soldiers of The Faith: Finucane

36.   Warfare In The Middle Ages: R. Humble

37.   Medieval Warfare: Koch

38.   Historical Atlas of The Crusades: A. Konstam

39.   The Rise and Fall of The Knights Templar: G. Napier

40.   Armies of the Crusades: Osprey Publishing

41.   Cathar Castles 1209-1300: Osprey Publishing

42.   Knights Templar Encyclopedia: The Essential Guide to the People, Places, Events, and Symbols of the Order of the Temple: K.Ralls

43.   The Rule of the Templars: J.M.Upton-Ward

44.   The Piebald Standard : Edith Simon

45.   The New Concise History of the Crusades: Thomas F. Madden

46.   The Real History of the Templars : Sharan Newman

47.   The Templars, A complete introduction to the Legendary Monk Warriors: Miguel Gomez

48.   The Knights Templar, Discovering the myth and reality of a legendary Brotherhood: Susie Hodge

49.   The Medieval Soldier : Vesey Norman

50.   Fighting for the Faith : D. Niccole

51.   El Cid; The Making of a Legend : M. J. Trow

52.   Warriors of the Lord: The Military Orders of Christendom : Michael J. Walsh

53.   Battles of the Crusades 1097-1444; from Dorylaeum to Varna : Devries, Dickie, Dougherty, Jestice, Jorgensen, and Pavkovic

54.   The Templars, Holy Warrior Monks of the Ancient Lands : Jack M. Driver

55.   Templar Organization, The Management of Warrior Monasticism : S.T. Bruno

56.   A Most Holy War, The Albigensian Crusade and the Battle for Christiandom: Mark Gregory Pegg  

57.   A to Z of the Knights Templar, A Guide to their History and Legacy: Gordon Napier

58.    Essential Histories; The Crusades : David Nicolle

59.   Battles of the Medieval World 1000-1500, From Hastings to Constantinople: Devries, Dickie, Dougherty, Jestice, Jorgensen, and Pavkovic

60.   Templar Knights and the Crusades; Charles R. Dillon

61.   The Enigma of the Knights Templar: Marilyn Hopkins

62.   The New Knighthood, A History of the Order of the Temple: M. Barber

63.   Knights of Jerusalem, The Crusading Order of Hospitallers 1100-1565: David Nicholle

64.   Crusader Castles in the Holy Land; David Nicholle

65.   Nobly Born, An illustrated History of the Knights Templar; Stephen Dafoe

66.   Templars, Hospitallers, and Teutonic Knights, Images of the Military Orders 1128-1291; Helen Nicholson

67.   Chronicles of the Crusades; Villehardouin & Joinville

68.   The Templars, The secret history revealed; Barbara Frale

69.   The Crusades in the Holy Land; Meron Benvenisti

70.   Teutonic Knight 1190-1561; Osprey Publishing

71.   The Crusades; Osprey Publishing Elite #19

72.   The Scandanavian/Baltic Crusades 1100-1500; Osprey Publishing

73.   Knight of Outremer AD 1187-1344; Osprey Publishing

74.   The Crusades- Essential Histories; Osprey Publishing

75.   The Illustrated history of the Crusades and the Crusader Knights ; C. Phillips

76.   Richard the Lionheart ; J. Gillingham

77.   Crusades ; Terry Jones & Alan Ereira

78.   The Siege of Jerusalem, Crusade and Conquest in 1099; Conor Kostick

79.   The Templars, The History & The Myth; Michael Haag

80.   The Crusades, History and Myths Revealed; Michael Paine

81.   Leper Knights: Order of St Lazarus of Jerusalem in England, c.1150-1544;  D. Marcombe

82.   The Templars, Knights of Christ; Regine Pernoud

83.   God's Battalions, The Case for the Crusades; Rodney Stark

84.   Knights in History and Legend; Constance Bouchard

85.   The Crusades- A Brief Insight; Christopher Tyerman

86.   A Brief History of the Knights Templar; Helen Nicholson

87.   Holy Warriors, A Modern History of the Crusades; Jonathan Phillips

88.   Armies and Enemies of the Crusades 1096-1291 (PDF); Ian Heath

89.   The Crusades- A History of the War for the Holy Land; Thomas Asbridge

Very impressive list. HUZZAH!!! I only have about 4 of those. My collection is many of knighthood and orders in general

Invictus Maneo
Lord Clisto

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

I have more on general Knighthood and the Warfare in the Middle Ages, but these seal with or mention the Orders or the Crusades.

[Sir William Marcus]

Brother, you might quite possibly exceed the legal limit of books focusing on the crusades 

very impressive

[Monsignor de Beaumanoir]

Brother, you might quite possibly exceed the legal limit of books focusing on the crusades 

Is there REALLY such a thing...........if so............would you adhere by it?

I'm ADDICTED......I admit it.

CA= Crusader Anonymous, WMA= Warrior Monks Anonymous, DVA= Deus Vult Anonymous

"Hello all.....I'm Cliff.....and I'm addicted to the Crusades...."

[Sir William Marcus]

Admitting to an addiction is a big step in the road to recovery my brother.  Unfortunately your addiction has been rendered harmless and quite acceptable.

Feel free to continue

[Lord Magnus]

Admitting to an addiction is a big step in the road to recovery my brother.  Unfortunately your addiction has been rendered harmless and quite acceptable.

Feel free to continue