Doublet for ladies? How to keep warm

[Captain Dungcaster]

It seems to me I had seen an image on this site of a Lady in garb and what looked like a doublet worn with a skirt. Was I just seeing things? I ask this because my wife would like to know how to improve the warmth of her Ren Garb. What is period and functional

[isabelladangelo]

There are MANY ways to have warm garb.  And no, you weren't seeing things.  :-)

http://www.festiveattyre.com/research/diary/diary6.html  - There are a couple up at this site.  



The one above is an extant women's doublet from about 1570's.


Now, of course, these are all late 16th Century.  Women didn't wear doublets until the 1570's in England and it was considered somewhat risque given it was seen as a man's garment.  

For warmth; coats, Spanish surcotes, lining skirts in fur, lining sleeves in fur, muffs, and so much more.   There are tons of examples of what they wore in winter all of which are quite lovely.  

[Adriana Rose]

Simplicity 3782 has a pretty good base for a ladies doublet. I have seen some variations of the bodice turned into a doublet.

For warmth I use longjohn leggings and shirts under my garb. I also have a flannel chemise and pantaloons that I wear too. We froze our collective bums off one weekend so I made warm under things and we have yet to have a cold weekend again but always be ready. Velvets and wools are good to have at least one skirt out of too. Oh and dont forget a good cloak.

[McGuinness]

Definitely layer up. Long johns are good - if the neckline shows, just cut it down below the bodice's neckline.

[isabelladangelo]

There is a lot of garb that will keep any lady warm and still be period:
Quilted petticoats!   - I have one for my 18th C garb and have been meaning to make one for my 16th C. 

Slightly thicker high necked linen smock.   -  You loose a lot of heat out of your shoulder/neck area.   Even a light covering will help immensely.

Ladies pantaloons - http://realmofvenus.renaissanceitaly.net/workbox/extdraw.htm  They had them.  The thicker embroidered extant ones look very much like ones that show up in many illustrations from the later 16th C.   Adding a bit of a heavier lining to those would be fine for winter wear.  However, even the thin ones will help, especially with a quilted petticoat.

Also, don't forget the materials the garb is made out of.  Wool and velvet are both wonderful for colder temps.   Gloves, muffs, hats, and coats also help.   No one needs to go for something modern under their garb - it got cold in the Renaissance too.

[Anna Iram]

I'm not certain if cloaks are HA, but it's what I wear. I live in Florida, but our late winter faires can be cold and damp. Nothing like my lightweight wool cloak to keep the elements out. Added bonus, the hood protects my hat until I can get in out of the rain.

Yes also to a high neck chemise/ partlet, and warm stockings and don't forget some pretty doeskin gloves.

[gem]

Slightly thicker high necked linen smock.   -  You loose a lot of heat out of your shoulder/neck area.   Even a light covering will help immensely.

I second this. I find that if I wear my partlet and a cap that covers my ears (both shown in my avatar), it really does go a *long* way to alleviating any chill (without being overwarm when the day heats up in the afternoon).

Coats are also period, and a lot warmer and more practical than cloaks. I'm partial to doublets, myself, and a Google search for "doublet bodice" (to distinguish it from men's doublets) or "doublet gown" will bring up lots of hits. Margo Anderson's Elizabethan Lady's Ensemble includes a pattern for a doublet bodice, as do Patterns of Fashion and The Tudor Tailor. Tudor Tailor also has a pattern for a less fitted jacket, which they call a waistcoat (like this), and a couple more cold-weather options that are quite fetching.

They also had really beautiful sweaters, though they don't show up in portraits that often, that are reminiscent of modern Dale of Norway cardigans. Isabella, I seem to recall you have a link to one of the extant pieces?

I don't think wearing modern long underwear is a problem, personally; most of us probably haven't added a set of bias-cut (or frame knitted) woollen stockings to our garb yet, after all. A nice pair of silk leggings will do the same job discreetly and comfortably, and you won't have to pile on as many bulky layers of skirt simply to stay warm.  (Does anyone remember in "The King's Speech" when Geoffrey Rush's sons are reading in their apartment--wearing their winter coats because it's so chilly? And that was the 20th century! Yeah. I'm guessing they didn't like being forced into all those bulky extra layers any more than we do!)

[lady serena]

Margo Anderson has a doublet pattern, they are very good patterns but her patterns are not cheap. here is a link if you are interested.  Main site - http://www.margospatterns.com/
doublet pattern - http://www.margospatterns.com/Products/ElizWrdrb.html

[isabelladangelo]

http://larsdatter.com/knit.htm  - all knitted items!

The silk jackets -or cardigans as we'd call them today- were mostly worn in the home and not really outside of it.  My guess is they were more like a robe and less like a modern sweater in terms of how they viewed them. But yes, they very much exist.

[Anna Iram]

I'm curious what your wife's current garb is, Captain. Is she wanting to have something made to suit your own garb, or does she wear something more casual?

[operafantomet]

They also had really beautiful sweaters, though they don't show up in portraits that often, that are reminiscent of modern Dale of Norway cardigans. Isabella, I seem to recall you have a link to one of the extant pieces?

Camiciolas - halfway down here: http://aneafiles.webs.com/glossary.html

As for period, functional and warm: you've gotten tons of good advices already. But in general: layering. I've written about it in Italian context, but it could easily be transferred to other styles as well. Most of the items were in use all over Europe, though the style might have varied. Here is picture examples: http://aneafiles.webs.com/renaissancegallery/italian.html

Over the dress your wife can wear various items to keep warm. A large cloak is wonderful, but would be slightly old fashioned for mid/late 16th century style. Shaped doublets and jackets became more popular. You've gotten nice examples of this already, so I won't add too much to that. In foul weather, a short cloak only covering the shoulders were sometimes used too. It was usually made of wool felt dipped in/inserted with oils to make it water proof. It usually had a hood.

As for jackets, it's often considered Jacobean (I.E. 17th century), but the other day I wrote a bit about the Italian 16th century equivalent in my blog, here: http://operafantomet.livejournal.com/246447.html

Hope it gave you a couple of ideas!

[operafantomet]

A garment which became vastly popular in Italy in the second half of the 16th century was the zimarra. It's a long, wide overdress which probably was inspired by the kaftans of the Ottoman empire. It often had frog fastening in the front and/or ornamental trims, and it could be sleeveless for summer, or fur lined for winter. It could also have detachable and/or hanging sleeves. I don't know how much popularity these overdresses gained in the rest of Europe, but in Italy (especially Venice and Florence, which did quite a bit of silk trade with the Ottomans) they became incredibly popular, until the more fitted doublet overdress took over.

Examples from portraits:



Especially the ones worn by Giulia Giulia Gonzaga (1) and Countess Livia da Porto Thiene (4), looks gorgeous. Imagine being wrapped in soft fur on a cold autumn/winder day... M-m-m... But it would probably be an expensive item to recreate if it's to be fully lined. I'm mostly mentioning it to show they dressed for summer and winter in the past as well, just as we do today. By the use of drawers, wool stockings, partlets, knitted sweaters, fur lined overdresses etc. they knew how to keep warm!

Few or none 16th century zimarras has survived. One from late 16th or early 17th century Venice can be found in a museum in France, however:
http://realmofvenus.renaissanceitaly.net/workbox/extwomclo5.htm

[DonaCatalina]

Definitely layer up. Long johns are good - if the neckline shows, just cut it down below the bodice's neckline.

I get silk long johns for winter use. They are less bulky than cable knit and they are just as warm.

[isabelladangelo]

A garment which became vastly popular in Italy in the second half of the 16th century was the zimarra. It's a long, wide overdress which probably was inspired by the kaftans of the Ottoman empire. It often had frog fastening in the front and/or ornamental trims, and it could be sleeveless for summer, or fur lined for winter. It could also have detachable and/or hanging sleeves. I don't know how much popularity these overdresses gained in the rest of Europe, but in Italy (especially Venice and Florence, which did quite a bit of silk trade with the Ottomans) they became incredibly popular, until the more fitted doublet overdress took over.

They are called Spanish Surcotes in England. 

http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/TBElizabeth1a.jpg

QEI owned and wore several. 

[Adriana Rose]

Those do look very comfy.