for those who sew for and "help" other sew

[ladyharrogate]

I have a touchy question that I am in need of advice on.  I am a professional costumer, working both for myself and for theaters costuming and stitching for shows.  This is my livelyhood and I'm pretty good at what I do.  Recently however I've run into a bit of a problem.  While I am "very" reasonable on my prices many of the people needing costuming still find it too expensive for their tastes.  So, they decide to make their own garb, which I encourage and think is a wonderful thing.

Just this week I've gotten several calls from people wanting help.  One called and asked me to go fabric shopping with her and when I asked what she was needing so I could schedule her in my book and block out time to work on her piece she promptly replied, "oh, I don't want you to make it, I just need you to show me how to make it and help me". 

This is happening a lot and I really do want to help people with costumes.  I'm always happy to give tips or if a group of us are going to a fabric store I don't mind helping with pattern and fabric suggestions.  However, I am very busy with my work and if I take time to "help" people make their costumes I often find myself spending more time than if I had just made it myself, not to mention the frustration of trying to teach novice stitchers the very basics (imagine someone who has no concept of garment construction wanting something made that there is not even a pattern for).

Is it wrong for me to tell them I charge for this service?  I honestly feel that if I do not I will be taking away from my paying customers who are expecting the high quality, well researched garments I try to make.  When I take time out to "help" people who don't want to pay my for custom pieces I have less time to make my costumers garments and end up having to do things like ship next day air or rush to finish a job.

What do you guys think?  I'd love to know from both fellow customers and also those who are in the position of just wanting a hand with making their own costuming.  I feel a bit odd charging for this but I just can't keep wearing myself out "helping" people!

Thanks,
Angela Harris
Lady Harrogate of Fairehaven

[gem]

Speaking for myself, I would *kill* to have a friend who sewed. But if said friend did so *professionally,* I would feel incredibly awkward imposing on her time. (I often feel incredibly awkward imposing on people, though, so I would never, ever be ballsy enough to ask someone a "favor" like that!).

From another perspective, however... I'm a full-time writer (published novelist, etc). In the writing community, it's very common to have relationships with other writers where you read and critique each other's work, and it's definitely not uncommon to mentor other writers who are not as far along in their careers (ie, unpublished ones). Critiquing a full novel manuscript, not to mention meeting with the other writers to discuss our work (not to mention the travel time, as I live in a large metro area and it takes a good hour to make a round trip pretty much anywhere), DEFINITELY takes away from my work day, and there are times I can't participate. I also have a critique partner who has become a professional editor, so she now charges clients for what we typically do for each other, for free.  A couple of months ago, I asked if she'd have time to review a manuscript for me, on a very tight schedule. I *begged* her to let me pay her, but she just said, "We're critique partners. You'll return the favor for me someday." 

All of that said, outside the circle of those close relationships, no, I wouldn't be in a position to be able to critique a manuscript for someone I did not know well, without some kind of compensation (and generally I simply say I don't have the time, because that is the truth).

Nothing in the universe REQUIRES you to help people--or even to *want* to help them. I don't think most people would ever ask a friend who owned a landscaping business to prune their trees for free (or maybe they would), or expect to eat for free in a friend's restaurant... or ask that friend for cooking lessons. Or expect a doctor friend to come treat them at home when they're sick.

Good luck with this! To save yourself some sanity, you might take a few minutes to put together some quick resources for people who ask you for help: local costuming guilds or sewing lessons, stores with good customer service, websites like this, etc.

[ladyharrogate]

thank you Gem.  I think that offering resources is a fantastic idea and something I can even do from my website.  I do have a few friends that I help and they also try to help me out with the things they can do, like one who sewed some buttons while I helped her.  I don't mind that so much.

One of the things I love about the boards is how everyone helps each other.  I've often responded with ideas or techniques that I've found work, etc.  I don't look at that as being a bad thing, it's just, like you say, there are not enough hours in the day to do it all.

[LadyShadow]

I feel bad that this is coming to your door.  But I agree with Gem.  Best of luck.

[bellalye]

I have definitely felt the negative side of this question before, not for sewing per se, but for another aspect of costuming (wing making).  My advice would be to help, yes, but to restrict your help to tips and suggestions.  Also, steer away from aiding those or sharing techniques you developed if the person you would help intends to sell.  I myself unintentionally threw away my position in an isolated market by helping someone in this way (I was unaware of their intent at the time).  There is definitely a difference between helping (which I think of as friendly and as an easy favor) and working/consulting.  As a professional, it's your right to charge a fee for the use of your hard-earned knowledge and skill, whether that be for sewing or sharing your knowledge (after all, isn't this why teachers and college professors are paid?)

*climbs off soapbox*

You are worth it!

toodles!  

[flidais]

First I'd like to say how wonderful you are to be the type of person who even cares to take time out of your busy life to help others.  I think that's a fantastic thing.

I do sew garb, and I have friends ask me to help them and I always enjoy doing it.  But they are good friends, and at some point in my life they all help me out in some way.  So it's kinda like bartering if you wanted to put it into that sort of context.  But I think if I started having allot of other people asking for help, I'd have to approach it differently.  Perhaps you could offer some workshops.  Starting with some basic sewing classes.  Where you can help several people at one time, make a little money and not have it take up too much of your time.  When I started making my garb, I paid $50 for a day long garb workshop, and it was well worth it.  We all already knew how to sew, but she taught us how to make cute little buttons, showed us allot of really great embellishment tips and tricks, let us copy a hat pattern she had drafted and a caul pattern, and then we all went fabric shopping after eating pizza.   So I think that helping when you can is great, but if this is your livelyhood and it's taking away from you being able to do your job, I do not think it's out of line to either ask for compensation or to try and compress all of your "helping" together to make it a little less time consuming.
Hope everything works out great!

[Lady Isabella]

My two sense:
The info here is free, use it. This is how we help each other. Its fun.
For the professional, like you, charge baby charge.

I own a Collision repair shop. I fix cars to make money, not friends.
It's how I pay the bills.

Hope that did not come off Bitchy.

[Lady Kathleen of Olmsted]

Because I too sew for a living doing Custom Commissions and Alterations, I have been asked at times to do my services for FREE. I charge a minimum fee when someone needs my help on something who is making their own costumes or garb. When I do one on one instruction, again, I charge a nominal fee.

Because I have a Price I charge per hour to clients, when doing business with Theatres, Churches, and other Business entities, I have a Business rate I charge per hour that is fair. If the client is a family member or very close to me, I charge the "Family Rate". I won't do much for FREE. One you do something for someone for FREE, then everyone will want you to do things for them  for free. Word gets around.

Custom made garb is not cheap in the beginning, but worth it in the long run if it is well made of good materials, it fits right, and is made to last.

What is your time worth for one hour? If you have a  price, say $20 an hour for your level of experience for example, then you can work from there.

[ladyharrogate]

thank you all, what you've said echo's my thoughts.  It's nice to know I'm not being ugly LOL.

[LadyStitch]

When I started sewing professionally I had to start charging a consulting fee.  I had friends that just wanted me to go fabric shopping with them and to source materials for them.  This takes me away from paying customers. This is also why I haven't sewn any garb for myself in 6 years 
I finally had to tell people that if you want my "professional" help you have got to pay me in some way.  It may not be much, but my time is money. 
I have had people who just want me to make the pattern for them, and expect only to pay a couple bucks for it.  I'm sorry if I spend 2 hours building a custom pattern you have to pay for it. 

On the other hand, if someone comes to me with a question on how to do something I can point them to resourses and offer suggestions. I'm not going to do it for them unless they pay for it. 

The only way I can make my husband's garb is that it is a portfolio item.  Each year I pick something that in a challange for me to make and stretch my skills.  Typically it is something for him.  I use that in all my advertising that year.  Otherwise I know his garb would be pushing well over 1-2K in custom work alone.

In summary: This is your buisness. If they want to hire you to do your trade, then they must pay you.  If they want advise, that is free.  Just don't let your heart over shadow your buisness. You are a professional, be treated like one.

[Kate XXXXXX]

Tell them up front that you charge a 'shopping fee' of $X per hour plus travel and lunch!  After all, you are then acting as a specialist personal shopper.  You need to be reimbursed for both your time and your expertise.

There are a number of us professionals here who will critique a garment, off fitting advice and sewing method advice for free to help sewing enthusiasts.  However, if folk are ASKING for what amounts to sewing lessons, charge for those.

[Hoowil]

For a few years my brother did work as a web designer. If somebody wanted him to show them how to set something up, instead of setting it up himself, he would charge his regular rate. If anyone complained, he would respond that by teaching them at all, he was in fact loosing himself a customer, and taking longer to do the project as well, thus should in fact be charging more. It usually got people to see it more from his point of view.
I myself worked for years as a mechanic, and had friends ask if I could help with their cars. Generally, I'd tell them it would depend on what else I had going on, that if I was to pre-schedule and make arraignments to do it that I may have to look at it as work. If they supplied parts, cool. And the people who took me up on it had no problem paying me if I said I was short on cash, and needed something for my time (even if it was just lunch and coffee for while we worked). For Friends who wanted to learn, or had no problem helping, it worked for them, as it was cheaper than a shop, and I got paid for doing something I really didn't mind doing, while spending time with friends.
Over all, I'd say you should approach it on a case by case, person by person basis. This is your trade, and you have a marketable set of skills. Your time is worth money. However... my father was a chef for a very long time, and when asked about wether he cooked at home, his response was always "do you think the mailman goes for a walk on his day off?". He would go out of his way to make the blandest, most boring food imaginable when he made food at home so that we wouldn't ask him to. But even a chef has to cook for himself and his family sometimes, and you spend time and energy sewing for yourself and I assume your family. Because its something you do for a living it gives you the right to be mercenary about it, but its up to you just how mercenary you want to be, and are comfortable about being. Sharing your talents with friends can be fun, and endear you to them all the more, especially if they know you could be charging them.

[operafantomet]

I agree with what others have written:

In internet communities etc. I don't mind sharing research and giving advices. That's one of the things I love about the internet - it's accessible and full of useful info, no matter where you're from and what your abilities are. Much of what I've learned comes from the internet, or at least that's where my interest was sparked.

But if people seek you out and want your help in person, based on your profession, they better pay for it... You don't seek out a hair dresser and expect him/her to cut your hair for free, right?

[LaurenLee]

I am a dog trainer.. and I suffer this problem daily!  I will give advice to friends, but the level of advice  I give to strangers is just enough to make sure they know I am a professional, I know what I'm talking about, and they would be wise to hire me     I'll admit I'm not consistent, and I have done free lessons for those who can't afford them and are about to give their dog away to a shelter... so I guess I'd have to say "keep an open mind".  If the person you are giving free advice to could NEVER afford your services right now, you can go as far as you like.  They WILL speak of your generosity and talent, and it could bring you more paying business.

If your field is very competitive, it pays to build a great reputation in that field, any way you feel comfortable doing!  (does that make sense? )

Cheers,
Lauren

[Lady Kathleen of Olmsted]

This particular community is the EXCEPTION rather than the RULE.

Why??? Because many of us here sew  professionally for a living, and many here sew for pleasure. What we can learn from another enhances that pleasure all the more. I have learned much here as a result that I can relate that information to new clients.

TIME is MONEY. So it must be spent wisely.

[lollergirl]

i do commission work occasionally but am by no means a professional and i've had to learn to set very clear boundaries about what i'll do for free.  which isn't much any more.  i've had people expect everything from replacing buttons to making a full set of custom draperies & valances for free.  i'll give basic tailoring advice or help a friend pick out fabrics if i was going to go shopping anyway but other than that i'm charging for my time.  i've got an actual paper-and-ink list that i can hand someone so that there's no mistake that i mean business when i say that what they're asking me to do is something i expect to be paid for.  

i've also found that i'm very protective of my intellectual property.  i've developed a lot of personal techniques over the years through trial & error and i'm very wary of sharing them.  i tend to hold back a bit when giving a "how-to" session.  for example: if someone wants to know how to make fairy wings, i'm more than happy to show them the basic pantyhose technique but if they want anything more complicated than that they'll just have to pay me to make them.  

[Lady L]

Here's my tale. My Mom likes to help people, especially when it comes to sewing, quilting, or crocheting. Someone asked her if she would show them how to crochet a rug. So, of course, she did. Next thing she knew, that person was *teaching* a class and charging for what my Mom taught her to do, for free. And THEN, the technique showed up published in a book! I know crocheting rugs is not a new thing, but my Mom has her own techniques and it was quite obvious what happened.

[Dayna]

If someone wants anything, they're going to pay for it in some way.  If they want fabric advice, they'll pay me to go with them, so it's to their advantage to have fabrics pre-selected and then we'll go take a look.  It might just be buying my lunch if I was going to that store anyway, or it might be fabric for time.

I don't do a lot of custom garments lately since my client base is 400 miles away, but things like sleeves and forepanels and skirts that are more forgiving.  I charge a "standard" amount 'cause I know pretty much how long it takes to make them.

I embellish garments, so I will give an estimate and initial design concept, which goes back with me if they don't give me the commission.  I buy the materials and they reimburse, and labor is negotiated either by the hour or by the piece.  No one gets my designs, no one learns my "tricks", unless they are paying me for lessons.  I have a full-time job already, since there's little to no way that most people could afford 50 hours of beadwork at a living wage.

Harsh, maybe, but every hour I spend with someone giving my knowledge away, is an hour I could have spent working on a paying commission.  Yes, I'll barter skills for cash, there are things I hate to do.  I'd rather spend an hour beading someone's overskirt than spend 15 minutes making a pair of bloomers, so we swap and I get what I need (bloomers) instead of charging money which the customer may not have.  The customer then tells people who did the work.

You are not being selfish to expect something in return, whether this is how you make your living or not. 

[iain robb]

Nobody deserves to get anything free -- whether that is products or services or advice or help or anything.

Everyone who helps you in any way earns the right to be paid for that help.

If I want to give something away, that's my prerogative. And I enjoy doing that. But no one should ever expect me to give something away. People who expect me to give them something are the ones being rude.

[Cilean]

Angela Wrote:
I have a touchy question that I am in need of advice on.  This is my livelyhood and I'm pretty good at what I do.  Recently however I've run into a bit of a problem. 

A. "oh, I don't want you to make it, I just need you to show me how to make it and help me"
B.  Is it wrong for me to tell them I charge for this service? 
C.  What do you guys think? 




Hi Angela,

Answer to A:

Your time is expensive, I work for myself and I charge people accordingly.  So I need to make sure I have the time to finish my paid consignments, so yes I do need to schedule time for an outing.  I do feel you should be paid for your time as an 'Advisor' you could get several people together and make it a "Fabric Excursion Day". So this way you can kill several birds with one stone.

Answer to B: It is NEVER just a small thing, you will be called people will bring things to you for "Can you check this out" and "Can you help me do Blah"?First of all, you and I both know? These people will consume all of your free time.  So let me be blunt, charge for your time. 

Answer to C: So here was my plight;  I hold a sewing night at my home for new to the SCA. I had tons of books, and patterns and we typically have experienced sewers who can help people from week to week.  Enter a person who says she sewed before when she was younger and needs some help, I was still on maternity leave- I had a 5 week old baby at the time.  I went with her to the fabric store, and had her pick up an easy McCall's pattern that from start to finish should only take you 3 hours to make. I showed her the proper fabrics and she refused them. She decided she wanted a knit that was very pretty, but was a knit!   It was her choice, she also claimed to be a size 22, I explained that we had measured her and she was more a size 24 and that she should purchase that size accordingly.  So she purchased the materials and threads needed, at our next SCA meeting I had told her which days I was available and for her to call me....she did not so I asked for some friends to come over for dinner.

This lady shows up with all of her fabric, but no pins, no machine, not even scissors, at my home, with no call to me, no well anything!!!
She drops her fabrics on my sofa, while I was bringing down my own new Italian type gown I had just made, and I was showing my friend, and I was taken aback that this woman was here without notice.  Good manners has me and my friends helping her to cut out her gown, and then we pinned the whole thing together with my pins since she did not have any, while my dinner was baking.  I gave her all of the advice I could in this setting when she picks up my new gown and says why don't I make her one while I was at it.  My friend looked at her and said do you think Cilean is your slave? I laughed and said that the gown would be about $350.00 for me to make one, and she stared at me and then said Why you are not a real seamstress.....!  She left after that and then called me the day of the event she had planned on going to in garb, at 7am to a home that had a 7 week old baby in.... to tell me I did not cut the fabric correctly and when she sewed it together it did not fit!!

So that was my experience in helping someone to do something for free, it was not the last time I have helped people? But it is the last time I allowed someone to take advantage of me.  By the way? She never gave me back the pins, and pin holder, the patterns that she took to "Check out". It was a valuable lesson.



Your time is your own, you will do as you will with it, however don't be a doormat, and don't allow people to take advantage of your good nature and your time.

Cilean

[Adriana Rose]

I would have to say to the person that sure I will show you but I might charge you a bit of a fee. If you would take a class which is what they are basically asking you would pay a small fee.

There is nothing wrong with keeping food on your table, the economy sucks dead rat right now. I understand that people want to save money but asking a Seamstess to just help you is stupid when they make their money off of what you are asking.



I am no where near as good as most of you here but sewing takes time and sometimes is hard so you arent in the wrong at all with asking this. So go with your gut instincts on this.

hugs I hope this helped

[ladyharrogate]

thanks everyone!  Most have said exactly what I was thinking but I wanted to be nice and wasn't sure of where to find that balance. 

[Annastina]

I just came across this thread.  I don't post often, but I had to comment because I come at this from a consumer POV, not a merchant or craftsman.

I know just enough about sewing to think I can do it on my own, but more often than not, it ends in disaster.  The last time was so discouraging that I haven't looked at my machine in almost 2 years.  I would happily pay someone a consulting fee to take me shopping for material, give me advice on how to get started, etc.  And then I'd pay her (or him) again to help me with a fitting or two.  Having someone to help with just that would save me LOTS of money in mistakes.

[Hoowil]

I think you're an exception, it seems like alot of people don't really understand that having somebody walk you thru might as well be the time they spend sewing, and as a professional, they can request payment. I doubt many would argue that they wouldn't offer 'private lessons', but asking somebody to teach you their craft for free, because "they aren't doing it" is a different matter.

[LadyStitch]

Just last week I had co workers coming up to me asking me to make their kids halloween costumes because they saw the amazing coat I made for my rogue.  When I told them that if they were serious we could discuss the fee for my time over lunch some time.  They then got upset that I actually wanted PAYMENT of some sort.  Granted it might have been something relatively minor but the fact I wanted compensation hacked them off.  One had the gal to ask me  what right I had to demand payment to make them.  I pointed at my theater awards, the wall of programs of shows I costumed, and my degree. Ahh they could say was "Oh...." and left.  It was because of her that I had to hang the sign "I will not make your kids halloween costume." on the coat.

[CecilsTanequin]

Most of what I've read here is good sense and it's good to know a lot of people understand this conundrum. I already know I'm going to be dealing with the same situation soon. I just graduated with a degree in Theatre specializing in costuming and wardrobe. So here are some of my thoughts
1. I've invested a lot in my education and my knowledge and skills, though still growing, are hard earned. Nothing I do sewing related can be considered 'hobby' anymore. Just because this profession isn't as high-earning as others doesnt make it any less of a profession.
2. The writers helping writers is a decent comparison but so much of writing is subjective and highly based on individual creativity (talent not skill) - there's only so much you can "teach" about writing. On the other end of the spectrum is something like being an auto mechanic - skill and knowledge based. One would never ask a friend who's a car mechanic to fix your car for free. On a smaller scale would one be comfortable asking a friend who is a professional hairstylist to cut/style their hair for free? Something they would charge 30-50$ for for a client. What ladyharrogate and LadyStitch (and myself as a beginner) do professionally falls somewhere in between I think. A mix of subjective taste and creativity (talent) and hard earned experience, knowledge, and skill.
And so...
3. Suggestions and tips for free are one thing, but asking a professional for consultation should come w/ some offer of compensation. They've paid to take classes and paid precious time to cultivate their skills and hobbyists often want free mini-lessons from them so they can make their own costumes instead of paying professionals to make them.
By that token...
4. If a hobbyist wants to go solo to save money that's one thing. But if they want a really nice costume and think they have the skills to execute it and want help in consultation, they should be willing to pay for that help. It'll still be far cheaper than hiring a professional to do the whole thing afterall but this way they don't cut business out from under the professionals who live off their skills.

Sorry I'm not the best at organizing my thoughts and I intend NO SNARK at all. I do not look down on non-professional costumers by any means. Many of them know more than I still do and those that know less than I do have spent their time pursuing their own professions and I respect that (they're probably wiser than I am too).

Lastly, I think it's an issue of awareness as well. Non-pros and non-sewers often don't know that this is a living for some, and aren't aware of how much WORK it really is to hone these skills and produce good garments and costumes. Like LadyStitch ran into in an extreme degree, some people just don't realize.

[crazyrennie]

As with others,I just saw this post.
My .02 comes from a leatherworkers background not necessarily a tailor point of view.
I ask people if they have seen the movie "A Knights Tale'(most have).
I ask them if they remember the farris(female armorer).
my favorite line that she has is
"Every drop of sweat as a price tag on it."
I don't mind helping people or answering questions but if I make something for you-my time and knowledge-such as it is has a price.

[Kate XXXXXX]

My bottom line is: If I OFFER you advice, that's my prerogative.  If you ask me to do something, expect to pay.

With some folk I do skill or other swaps: I take up trouser hems for my neighbour of 20+ years: she can sew, but not as well or as fast as me.  And she looks after our cats when we are on holiday.  I help another friend with her sewing problems.  She sorts out my computer problems, when they are beyond Himself's skill area.