Faire: Should it be Fantasy or Historically Accurate or a Mix?

[Count Adolfo]

I was at a Con here in Orlando not long ago, in garb... and had several Sci Fi people come up to me asking who I was.

I had some fun with it... told them I'm from a book that's not available for purchase yet... but to keep an eye out for it.








Anyone wanna write a book?

[Dirtfarmer]

I do prefer historically based, and Elizabethan faire because I like the framework to work with.  I will, however, attend any faire, other than pure fantasy which holds not interest for me.  Now, I use the term historically based because as pointed out earlier, in many, not all cases it would be a much more dreary affair in addition to none of us are completely 100% historically accurate, just by the fact that historians still don't know exactly is historically accurate in many cases.  There is conjecture and theories, but none of us were there.

That being said, there is room for fantasy aspects at faire.  I think Bristol is a pretty good example of a good mix, although, in my limited exposure to BRF last year,  it did spill over a little bit into court, which gets under my skin a bit.  I choose to just ignore the fantasy aspect of it when I am in character.  Faire is not only entertainment, but can be educational also... but don't base your masters thesis on anything your learn there.

As far as the Klingons and Stormtroopers.....If they pay to get in the gates, wear what you want.  I saw the comment above that it is rude, and I'll have to respectfully disagree with that opinion, but it can be distracting and in some cases very funny, I mean common' Stormtrooper in a kilt, that is pretty funny.  Rude to me would be showing up at an Elizabethan faire, dress as Elizabeth and saying you are queen.

[Cobaltblu]

I gave some further thought about whether or not it is rude to have Stormtroopers, Darth Vader, Anime Characters, Star Trek, etc at a Renaissance festival.

I know many people may think it is cool or novel to see a few Stormtroopers at a Renaissance Festival because it is something different.  However while a few might be weird and cool and interesting...if there are many of these people it certainly damages the atmosphere of the faire and therefor the experience which 99.9% of the patrons have paid to experience.

I know a Stormtrooper may be a paying customer and have heard many comments that if they pay to enter then they have the right to dress how they like...BUT it is still rude because it lessens the Renaissance Experience which 99.9% of the patrons have paid THEIR hard earned money to experience.  And while one or two Stormtroopers might be a novel distraction, any significant number of people dressed like this does create a very real detriment to the other 99.9% of patron's experience.

Where do you draw the line?  If you feel that up to 3 Stormtroopers per faire day is an acceptable and novel distraction...then what if a group of 50 shows up for a Star Wars Invasion...or what about 100?  I certainly agree that  a paying customer at a ren faire should be able to dress like they please however it IS rude if large numbers of people dress in garb which is not remotely related to something renaissance or medieval.

I understand money is money and a ren faire is a business which needs the patrons to feel like they are wanted but any business will not appreciate a large number of patrons coming and dressing in inappropriate attire.  The reason the faire's themselves have garb rules for cast members and staff is because they realize their business is portraying the renaissance and providing a quality experience for the 99.9% of customer who attend a renaissance festival for a renaissance experience.

Many restaurants have attire restrictions...and nearly every store has a "No Shirts, No Shoes, No Service" sign.  I do not want people to drive for hours to attend a faire and then dress as Darth Vader with 20 Stormtrooper guards as an escort and be turned away at the gate for inappropriate attire...however all it would have taken to avoid this fiasco would be respect for the experience which 99.9% of patrons go to receive.

Maybe I am out of touch with today's society however I always respect the environments I put myself in and respect the experience's others are wishing to have.

Regards,

CB

[theChuck]

*shifty eyes* Actually theChuck?

I do. And I'm usually one of them. Any excuse to wear a kilt, right? Plus, you can pass off garb as cosplay rather easily. "Me? I'm william wallace!"

I wear ren garb at sci-fi conventions. We sell fairy wings at both fairs and conventions, friends of ours sell thousands of dollars worth of elf ears at both. We couldn't exist if the patrons didn't want it. The Stormtroopers play along with it. At one con last year a squad of them walked past us in the food court, and the leader said "Watch out, they have big bugs here."

Ummm.... I know here in Oklahoma a number of us rennie performers who take our acts to Cons (sci-fi and anime) to fill in dates on our performance schedules.  I will be taking my troupe to DEFCON 7 in August (our first Con) and the owners are very excited about our "crossing over."  From what I've heard, Rennies are taken very well at Cons.

I was at a Con here in Orlando not long ago, in garb... and had several Sci Fi people come up to me asking who I was.

man, i got shut down on that one. that's okay, though; i'm happy to be proven wrong.

though.. i guess the atmosphere is different. sci fi cons are intentionally multi universe, so you've got people showing up from star wars, firefly, star trek, etc. ren faires are more specific - it's one time period - so it seems a little strange to have an influx of universes that are entirely offtopic. having said this, there are faires out there, like the wicked winter one in new jersey, that are more geared towards all different universe.

i don't feel nearly as strongly about this as cb does, though...

[escherblacksmith]

well, I haven't seen a stormtrooper invasion or any seroius amount of sci-fi folks wandering about a fair, so, I would have to assume you have and that is what is driving this.

I have seen "invasions" of Jack Sparrows, I have seen angst-filled Goth herds, I have seen more . . . how shall I put this . . . culturely disabled individuals imbibing a few dozen too many budwiesers and staggering about the grounds then anyone should.

All of these things amuse and annoy me depending on the day.  And with infinite more frequency then sci-fi folk, who, so far, are much more cordial and polite then any of the above mentioned groups.

but, that is just me, YMMV.

[Dayna]

Ren folk at Sci-Fi conventions?  Well, if they're dressed as wench or peasant, they're from STNG, the episode with the Brinloidi and Mariposans.  If they're dressed as royals, except for the hair the women are Centauri (can't help ya on the men).

Star Wars/Star Trek/Anime at Ren fest?  They paid to get in, so let them in, but why in the world anyone would Want to be so out of place is beyond me.

Goth herds/LOTR/Fantastikals?  People 500 years ago did believe that such creatures existed, so go right ahead, we can always refuse to see them (don't be silly, fairies aren't Real!) and thus entertain other people in the area.

Dayna

[Capt Gabriela Fullpepper]

Let me post a question within this question and not a hijack.

Do you think those that do dress up as Stormtroopers, Darth Vader, Star Trek, Goth vampires are just doing it to grab attention.

I know for me to dress in any Ren Faire style of dress it is 1.) to Add to the atmosphere of the faire and bring it more to life. and 2.) to grab a wee bit of my 15 minutes of fame... i/.e it's infinately more fun to be stopped at faire to have your picture taken or asked if you are the Queen,/Princess/court than just walking around in mundane clothing where you are exaclty like everyone else walking around. No one notices you.

For those that dress in Sci-Fi garb it's a way for them to get a little attention and try to have fun.

Now personally I'm not a fan of those that dress in Sci-Fi, Goth or Anime at faires I think maybe they do it for a wee bit of spotlight.

Honestly if I were running a faire, i'd more likely to deny entrance into the faire with a barbarian or pirate dressed in little to nothing and their DUCKIES hanging out than a Stormtropper. Even though i'd rather NOT see those types at faire.

Just some thoughts.

[Black Armor]

I understand and pretty much agree with what CB is saying.  I do like the fantasy aspect but there is a big difference between medieval fantasy and sci-fi.  I enjoy the trolls, dwarves and dragons and they fit in at faire because that kind of thing falls into the medieval genre.  Stormtroopers and Star Trekkies don't.  I just don't think that it should be a free-for-all.  Like CB said, everyone there paid money to get in and they came to see a renaissance festival not a sci-fi convention.

And yes that's fine that people go to sci-fi conventions and wear their faire garb and are accepted.  I would imagine that is because the sci-fi genre is much more broad and encompasses most all things fictional and fantasy.  Just watch the sci-fi channel and you'll see that.        

[Captain Jack Wolfe]

Ren folk at Sci-Fi conventions?  Well, if they're dressed as wench or peasant, they're from STNG, the episode with the Brinloidi and Mariposans.

Or nearly any Season 10 episode of 'Stargate: SG1'.  

[Master James]

OK where to go with this?

I'm of two minds on this.  If the faire is going to try to portray H/A (or as close as you can get) then the entire cast should do that and do it properly.  Putting King Henry VIII in King Auther clothing is just flat wrong!  Having a 20 something Princess Elizabeth and Anne Boleyn still married to King Henry is wrong too.  IF the faire chooses to use real characters from history then do them right.  Period end of story.

That being said, if the faire chooses to be a fantasy faire then that is great as well.  You know what you are getting when you come in.  Carolina Renaissance Faire does a fantasy faire in that they have made up nobility that never existed but they do the faire in the renaissance time period and do it well.  They have fairies, ents and all kinds of creatures on cast and that is just fine because they are not trying to be H/A.

As far as patrons or playtrons go, I feel it doesn't matter that the faire is H/A or fantasy or both.  Whatever you want to wear as a patron is fine as long as its "street legal".  Period end of story.  We had a guy come dressed as a bannanna to VARF and while none of us would probably do it, he wasn't given grief for it either because that was HIS choice.

[Athena]

. . . culturely disabled individuals imbibing a few dozen too many budwiesers and staggering about the grounds then anyone should.

All of these things amuse and annoy me depending on the day.  And with infinite more frequency then sci-fi folk, who, so far, are much more cordial and polite then any of the above mentioned groups.

Bingo! Bubba with the beer gut and John Deere hat getting tanked in the pub with his minions (because there's always three or four of 'em) is much more distracting to me than any sci-fi character. But, as long as he doesn't get unruly and start harrassing other patrons, he has the right to be there just like everyone else. Hell, one year at TNRF a guy showed up dressed like Abe Lincoln! Yes, it was distracting, especially since the guy could've been Honest Abe's twin, but everyone had fun with it. At the end of the day it didn't spoil anyone's experience. That's why the argument that those who don't dress in accurate attire spoil the atmosphere doesn't wash with me. Someone once said faire is what you make it, and I couldn't agree more!

[Once Debauched]

People really belived the world was flat and that there were sea monsters, dragons and mermaids

You mean it's not and there aren't?  I'M CRUSHED!!!

I happen to like the fairies and pirates at my home faire and wouldn't change it for the world.  St. Louis, being a smaller faire and very family oriented, doesn't get a lot of the odd stuff like the larger ones.  We get the occasional Jedi or samurai, but I have to say my favorite "garb" was 3 young men who had grabbed bed sheets (possibly right out of the closet) and turned them into great kilts.  I loved em with their swords and shields in hand!

If I wanted H/A I'd join the SCA.  I'm happy with faire wear and fun!

[Black Armor]

I realize that everyone "has a right to be there" and I understand how some people have the opinion that "they're paying customers so let them wear what they want" but where do you draw the line?  I wouldn't even begin to suggest a strictly enforced HA faire because I think being that extreme would take the fun out of it for most people.  At my home faire (Michigan Ren Fest) it would probably take out half of the vendors too because of the things they sell (fantasy paintings, wax hands, potato skins...yummy, and Bud Light...double yummy).  I accept pretty much anything that fits into the medieval or medieval fantasy genre.   

At the same time I don't agree with the other extreme of saying "go ahead, wear whatever you want".  I think it defeats the purpose of calling it a "renaissance festival". If you say that people can wear whatever they want no matter what, then it just becomes a costume party and we might as well dispense with the renaissance theme altogether.  I realize that this is an extreme view and the majority of people will still dress appropriately but I'm just making a point.  Maybe storm troopers and Abe Lincoln don't bother you but they bother me and I am a paying customer too.  I spent a lot of time and effort to make a costume to wear to the ren fest that would fit into the genre and add to the atmosphere.  I don't think it's fair to say that I should be fine with some inconsiderate jerk in a Star Trek uniform, treating the ren fair like it's his own personal costume party or his opportunity to "get attention".  If they want to "be noticed or get attention" then they should put together a really great costume that fits in to the faire.  I get plenty of attention in my costume AND it fits in.           
 

[analise]

I'd go with, "wear whatever you want (that's legal) but we really encourage you to wear something that fits in the theme."

I like the stormtroopers and Jedi, personally, as I've said (but then, I'm also a fan of Star Wars and no, I wouldn't want to see the Fest taken over with them but seeing a group of them from time to time? Doesn't bother me in the least.

Of course, costumes like that most often show up on the last day of MDRF which is dubbed the Day of Wrong. Plenty of people do crazy stuff on that day (and I do always wonder what the typical person not "in the know" thinks about it).

[Black Armor]

Of course.  We also have a "day of wrong" and then by all means, go nuts with it!